Working SFP in Vista 32 bit.

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:28 am

If you want to have Scope in your VISTA - do the following:

- Manually install driver for Scope PCI cards, via the Device Manager. When the device once has been installed, get to the next step

- Put Scope 4.5 installation on the hard disk, right click on setup.exe and make it Windows XP compatible.

- Install it like you always do.

- Go to the installation folder and right click on .../Scope/app/bin/SFP.EXE, and make it XP compatible also.

- Enjoy

p.s. If an app doesn't work with SCOPE ASIO selected, make the app windows XP compatible also.

p.p.s If ANYTHING on vista doesn't work as usual, make it windows XP compatible and it will work

hope you like this, cheerz !

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:34 am

...forgot to tell - it was VISTA 6.0.6000 - I didn't tried any previous versions.

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:40 am

Great to hear! Can anyone confirm this, and would it work for XP64 too? Then migrate this topic to the Tips and Tricks forum, guess it will make many users happy

I've just ordered a new Core 2 Duo setup, and I'd love to migrate my Scope cards to that box. If not, I'll keep the cards in my current PC and get a *nix based music distribution for the new box.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 8:04 am

That's pretty cool!

By the way, I got it wrong before when I said that drivers were being moved out of kernel space for Vista, apparently a driver can live in *either* kernel or (now the preferred home) user space. Doh!

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:34 am

Well, if u are anxious to use the new technologies like me, but still want to use your old Scope platform, this is the workaround. I would LOVE to get the newest drivers for VISTA, but it is like not going to happen soon. So, I can use my scope card on core2duo processor with all software that I like, not having to wait for Vista to get mature When that finally happens, I will take the new stuff into it, but untill then, I will joyfully watch semi-transparent blurring windows go in and out into deepths of Aero - desktop

I simply do not understand this forum's people attitude "Standard PC and Compatibillity bullsh*t", where is an artistic touch of technically improved working enviroment ?

My goal was to try make scope functional on new platform making it interesting for people like me - having amateur studio with other uses from their PC instead only DAW. And has been prooven in the past that when you disable a lot of things in windows like ACPI or similar, the machine looses it's power. What use of dual cores, if one of them is SWITCHED OFF ?! So - newer hardware asks for a newer software. And in Vista, I can use the full potential of my PC, still using good old SCOPE. And compatibility mode is only a way of adressing the hardware - because - without it, Scope throws a HARDWARE NOT INSTALLED error ( although it is installed properly in the drivers list ) It really doesn't slow down anything. I think that Vista has a whole new way of using audio hardware, BTW.

So - If you want to use your new hardware with the new software - this is one solution - if not - then fine. Throw money on Core 2 Duo, and disable half of it, and then enjoy the crackling

About 64bit Vista : No, I haven't tried, but I am pretty shure that it can't be made - because of driver. It is 32bit. Like in Windows XP - 64bit - it is impossible to put 32bit driver in it. But ( ironicly ) who need 64bit, when 8bit sounds great on my Amiga 500 ( with filter turned on )

BTW If you try win vista, nothing in the world will make you to go back XP - it is really like in commercials - it is functional and lokks really nice. A lots of new features, and many of the old "stupidities" are fixed. This is off-topic, but I just installed it, and I am delighted - must share the joy with someone

And... who said anything about buying

Post by **garyb** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:13 pm

that's good news.
of course, core duo processors and scope work just fine in acpi mode in xp still. there should be vista drivers in a few months, so it's good to know that migration is possible in the mean time.

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:45 pm

psionic wrote:
And... who said anything about buying

There was smileys in my previous post , but they disappeared

I withdraw what I said about Vista. It is nice, functional, BUT IT EATS MEMORY like crasy. I hope it will be fixed, but honestly - I doubt. Price must be paid for all that graphic. So - Vista + BFD Drums or STYLUS RMX = dead hard disk due to swapping.

Back on disabling visual appearance

Good old XP will never die

OK, in year or two, I hope that Vista will get to its maturity, XP was a disaster for music in the early days also...

See you, cheerz

valis · Post by **valis** » Sat Dec 09, 2006 4:11 pm

I was actually going to post what a memory hog Vista is, but it seems you found out yourself. I'm still on 1Gb ram here and it leaves so little RAM left in the default install it's rediculous. You can pare that back a lot but tbh once I hit a low profile setup I was basically looking at Xp with a few minor tweaks here & there, and still it had double the Ram usage. Perhaps when I've got 4Gb of RAM it won't be as big of a deal...

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Sat Dec 09, 2006 5:28 pm

Sorry, I didn't want to make a Vista topic, but I was impresset by the look of it. We are still far from being able to use such a bulky piece of software and still get enough horsepower for audio appz to work with. But, if someone wants to experiment with it - here it is.

...but still, I am curious to know what have they done with the audio ? I found something about - 'giving priority to audio application' and 'using exclusive access to audio hardware' ... sounds interesting. That would be a true difference between XP and Vista - when you turn off the GUI, worth exploring.

Anyway, in my opinion, we are at least one year far away from going on to different OS. It must be supported by others, like Steinberg and hardware manufacturers ( like good old boys from CreamWare

). Then we will have to go on Vista. Year away, at least...

ratkinson · Post by **ratkinson** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 4:26 am

valis wrote:I was actually going to post what a memory hog Vista is, but it seems you found out yourself. I'm still on 1Gb ram here and it leaves so little RAM left in the default install it's rediculous. You can pare that back a lot but tbh once I hit a low profile setup I was basically looking at Xp with a few minor tweaks here & there, and still it had double the Ram usage. Perhaps when I've got 4Gb of RAM it won't be as big of a deal...

I was looking at speccing up a new Dell Pc the other day, just out of curiosity to see how much it would cost, and I was quite shocked when they had recommendations of 2GB to run Vista, just for basic computing(might have been speccing a games m/c). It doesn't seem that long ago when 1GB was good enough to run virtually anything. 256MB was enough to get XP up and running.

kylie · Post by **kylie** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 4:43 am

psionic wrote:So - newer hardware asks for a newer software. And in Vista, I can use the full potential of my PC, still using good old SCOPE.

what exactly does vista do with the "full potential of my PC", apart from wasting it for eyecandy? SCNR

thomashenrydavies · Post by **thomashenrydavies** » Thu Dec 14, 2006 2:27 am

I couldn't give a damn what Vista looks like. On an XP installation, the first thing I do is set the appearance to 'classic', and all graphic options to be optimised for speed. I like things simple, slick and functional. It is one of the reason I like XP a great deal more than OSX - its much easier and quicker to use.

I can see precisely no reason to think about a Vista switch - and I've just built a new Core2Duo box...

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:36 pm

kylie wrote:
psionic wrote:So - newer hardware asks for a newer software. And in Vista, I can use the full potential of my PC, still using good old SCOPE.
what exactly does vista do with the "full potential of my PC", apart from wasting it for eyecandy? SCNR

Well, why don't you use good ol'Win95 with your Core 2 Duo ? or Win 3.11 ? Back in the time of M$ DOS, it was said that using windows is just wasting resources, it looks nice and nothing more. That's because it was claimed by peope wich were not familiar with protected mode and 640k memory limit of every PC based system and similar stuff, IRQ messing... If you wanted to unlock the potential, you needed a VESA driver, SOUNDCARD driver, PROTECTED MODE driver (remember fasttracker 2 ?), and it would hopefully work. With windows, everything changed. And with every new processor, there is a new set of instructions, access methods and so on... Software must go in step with the hardware to support this. You won't get 2 processors if you disable multiCPU suport. I don't believe that Win95 has multiCPU support at all. So - working with 2 processors in Win95 is not very wise. You switched to newer OS - Windows XP. And now - similar is happening. I think that they rewrote the entire audio engine - and I hope it will bring some new features and speedups. So we are talking here of no eyecandy only (again - hopefully ).

My point is that there is nothing bad to go on new OSes. The look is one thing, but beneath the hud, there is a lot of improvements in code wich will utilise new features of a CPU. So I am convinced that when the time comes - Vista WILL replace old XP because of optimised routines and stuff ( but right now, I am asking myself how optimised code ate 1 GB of RAM, leaving me with nothing to work with

)

The proove of my statements is for example 64bit support. To unlock 64bit, you must switch to new OS - Right? That supports my previous claim: To unlock the full potencial of a PC, you WILL need a newer OS ( not Vista necesserily - but since the Vista IS that new software... )

I know that right now there are no 64bit apps, and Vista itself is a little crappy ( a little ?! ) but in time, it will hopefully improve, and switching will be unavoidable, just like switching to XP. And if that 64bit means speedup - then I'll go for it.

So:
This little...discovery I made is not meant for people like most on this forum, but just in case anyone would like to see how Vista will work with his good old Scope, here it is

P.S. Generally, I think that computer is a stupid gadget made to annoy it's user, WHATEVER OS you use, and if you want the job done - especialy live - on the air or similar - go and buy the hardware equipement ! Everything concerning PC is stupid - it stayed at x86 architecture - designed back in '70, and inherited all it's limitations 'till today ! The technolgoy behind it hit the ceiling. This whole 64bit and Vista seems like selling old stuff with a new look and name. I think that even SONY PS with right software would blow away PC from market ! My f***n MP3 player is more useful and faster than 99.5% media players on PC, for example !

psionic · Post by **psionic** » Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:53 pm

And one more thing concerning new look in Vista:

What is the brand of your mobile phone ? Certanly not Motorola 930c or Nokia 3200. So... Look does matter after all ?

Of course, this was only a ( little bit sarcastic ) joke, don't even bother replaying

Post by **hubird** » Mon Dec 25, 2006 6:10 pm

Why negative anyway on looks?
Aren't we born to make the world beauty?
Moreover, I don't see any conflict between functionality and beauty, on the contrary even.

Vista will look great, it's getting a nice copy of OSX, so no worries

(your turn Stardust!

).

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 4:12 am

http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/p ... a_cost.txt

valis · Post by **valis** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 3:36 pm

http://www.planetz.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=21046

tsol · Post by **tsol** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 8:05 am

in actual stance of things , as described above. Is it safe and stable running Scope 4.5 & Cubase 4 in winxp mode on vista?

how about all the others VSTi's ?

djsainz · Post by **djsainz** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 2:42 pm

tsol wrote:in actual stance of things , as described above. Is it safe and stable running Scope 4.5 & Cubase 4 in winxp mode on vista?

how about all the others VSTi's ?

I am running Scope 4.5 on Cubase SX3 and it isn't stable enough for professional use. Cubase will randomly crash or stop responding. I tried Cubase SX3 with my other soundcard X-Fi and that runs perfect if somewhat limited to poor synths and response.

I am not sure how I will cope with Cubase 4 with its optimized engine and an update for Vista 32 bit, I am on the verge of buying it, but dont particularly want to waste alot of money for the same unstability I get from SX3.

Post by **garyb** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:06 pm

better to get a oem version of xp home(about $90).....

that will be stable and professional. you'll also get a lot better performance because xp is not nearly as big a resource hog as vista. save money, more performance, less trouble. do you want the latest os or a great DAW?

wait about 6 months for the vista drivers if you must use vista(and cross your fingers).