Type II Versus Type I cards.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 7:25 am

I have 2 type 1 and 1 type 2 Creamware cards. I think I will sell the older ones and replace them with a new Pulsar. Will I see a big performace boost? Currently I'm getting more bombing than I would like.

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 10:42 am

I'm not sure about the performance boost from upgrading cards as we use old & new in the same system, but I know we're getting more crashes than expected when running the new Pro-12 plug on the 4.5 OS. Getting on my tits it is.

katano · Post by **katano** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:44 pm

my 2 cents:

9 Masterverbs with a PowerPulsar 2 (15 DSP's) and a Type 1 SRB (15 DSP's) cascaded with 5 s/tdm cables, then go PCI overload

16 Masterverbs with 2 PowerPulsar 2 (15 DSP's each), cascaded with 5 s/tdm cables. then got a dsp message...

pci performance is much better with the type 2 boards, this is my personal exp. and as some of you know, i need a good pci performance for my 24 ASIO-2 connections and big mixing/mastering projects including also the STW A100/P100.

conclusion:
If you use more pci intensive stuff and get the pci overload message often, i would definitively go for a second type 2 card...

cheers
Roman

[ This Message was edited by: katano on 2006-07-17 14:55 ]

wolf · Post by **wolf** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:58 pm

you'll get better performance !
Not in the sense of dsp boost, which always depends on how much you add, but regarding stability.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 2:17 pm

I think I figured I would be using 10 DSP chips instead of my current 11. By better performance I am refering to the PCI flow. I'm pretty sure it is causing Cubase to bomb. I always have to restart the SFP when Cubase Bombs and less frequently cold boot the computer. Since I have mixed type cards I'm told I'm not getting the best latency that I could. Even though the SFP doesn't use the CPU, I think the combination of heavy CPU and PCI flow is what is freaking out my computer. Or am I wrong about this? It might work better to have 2 cards instead of my current 3 as well. Any thoughts?

paulrmartin · Post by **paulrmartin** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 3:53 pm

How does one see whether one has Type 1 or 2 boards? Taking the computer apart?

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 5:21 pm

whether you have to open the PC depends on your memory: the 4 DSP cards are always type 1, the 15 chip type 1 versions lack the connector for the removable IO-plate.
[added]
All 3 and 6 DSP cards are type 2, including the Luna 1 (Luna 2 had just a better software bundle)

cheers, Tom

[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2006-07-18 01:42 ]

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 6:05 pm

If you have a Pulsar I, Luna I, or SRB I, then you have a type I card. If one of your cards is a type I card then it slows the whole system down but having a combination of type 1 and type 2 cards is better than just type 1.

Post by **garyb** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 6:50 pm

i have both in my machine and have no crashes. pci performance would be a little better with only type 2 cards, though...

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 7:00 pm

Okay well I can only load one instance of Ambience and even then I have to be sure not to have too many other modules so i have a different setup for recording and mixing. I would prefer to mix as I record.

I am wondering since you have both types, how do you know it will be just a little better with only type 2 card(s)?

[ This Message was edited by: braincell on 2006-07-17 20:03 ]

tgstgs · Post by **tgstgs** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:47 pm

gurus please correct me if im wrong!

if there is only one type 2 card in your setup you get the best latency you can;
pure type 2 card combs. only help to get less pci overflow; also less no more stdm connections . . . messages if thats your trouble;
cubase trouble most related to midi
good vibes from vienna

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 12:45 am

Braincell, why have a different project for mixing & recording when it's quicker to connect a handfull of asio connections in the routing window than it is to reboot SFP?

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 3:26 am

There are many connections and settings. The SFP is tedidius as hell.

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 3:31 pm

tgstgs, as to my experience you're correct. v2 cards are more forgiving, and adding a v1 card can degrade stability. Of course, if you don't experience any issues, stop bothering. But replacing v1 by v2 cards definately improved overall stability here. But even the pulsar1's have different revisions, and mine were from the first. A revised pulsar1 version may solve some issues in respect to the initial HW release...

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 4:06 pm

Thanks, I am sure at least one of them is the original. I can get a Pulsar at a decent price now. I will find a friend to buy the old cards. I hope the key transfers aren't a problem.

Post by **garyb** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 6:29 pm

On 2006-07-17 20:00, braincell wrote:
Okay well I can only load one instance of Ambience and even then I have to be sure not to have too many other modules so i have a different setup for recording and mixing. I would prefer to mix as I record.

I am wondering since you have both types, how do you know it will be just a little better with only type 2 card(s)?

hmmm. scope modules really shouldn't make all that much difference in how many instances of ambience are running in my experience. maybe there is another issue(old graphic card driver, old bios or...)

how much improvement you see depends on a lot of factors. personally, i don't have stability issues(nor do other computers i have built or setup) with the first gen cards, but the card's rev may have something to do with it as mentioned earlier. the main gain i've seen with v1 and v2 cards is in pci useage where one can use 12 instead of 9 masterverbs, a small improvement imho. your computer may behave differently. the combination of software might make a difference.....

*edit* ...but maybe you mean the STW ambient verb in which case, by all means, get 2nd gen cards.....

[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-07-18 19:32 ]

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:48 am

he does mean it - and that thing is a monster PCI wise, yet it just sounds amazing

Immanuel · Post by **Immanuel** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 2:40 pm

In my second PC I have the dreaded apollo 133 chipset from VIA - one of the worst things, that could ever happen to Pulsar. When I take out the Pulsar one and use 2 Pulsar 2s and one Luna, I can go very far with loading masterverbs without issues. With a pulsar 1 card in there, it is not so good. So if you have those kind of issues, you will very likely get a performance boost be going pure second generation.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 4:47 am

I don't have an AMD but it sounds like the new cards really helped and I think I will try it.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Wed Jul 26, 2006 7:21 pm

I could not wait for the keys so I went ahead and installed the Pulsar II. I took out the SRB I so I am using the Pulsar I, Luna and Pulsar II.

The performance is pretty decent, much better so I think I might keep the old Pulsar for a while.

The moral is that when using 3 cards, 2 type 2 cards is better than 1 type 2 card.

[ This Message was edited by: braincell on 2006-07-27 07:16 ]