I need a microphone preamp

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 11:27 am

I'm going to buy a microphone preamp but I can't spend a lot. I'm thinking the feature I want most is to have a tube. Some other features such as a limiter or compressor might be good to have too but maybe it's better to buy those separately. My microphone does not have enough output to record without bumping up the gain so much it adds a lot of noise. It's a senheinser 441 which I got a long time ago.

Post by **garyb** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 1:01 pm

if it's just a cheap one you want(that sounds nice)how about presonus?

http://www.presonus.com/html/products/bluetube.html

http://www.presonus.com/html/products/tubepre.html

http://www.presonus.com/html/products/digitube.html

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 1:17 pm

The JoeKee VC3 it's a great option, it is cheap and extremely good sounding.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 4:19 pm

I couldn't find a mention of Joekee on the web. The presonus seems like it could be one of the better cheap preamps.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 4:41 pm

I found this one, but it doesn't have a tube. It looks nice however.

DMP3
Dual mic preamp / direct box
MSRP $ 249.95 USD

Any professional recording engineer will tell you that quality microphone/instrument preamps are just as important as the microphones themselves. Unfortunately, the preamps found in most affordable mixers don’t do justice to the rest of your gear… and most high-quality preamps cost more than your computer. That’s why we made the affordable new DMP3.

Dual mic preamp / direct box
Ultimate Performance for:
• Optimizing signal level
• Recording with soundcards
• direct recording of instruments

Why a DMP3?
The DMP3 isn’t just any two-channel microphone/instrument preamp. M-Audio’s design team embarked on a mission to combine years of experience with the finest components in order to bring you an impressive blend of high quality and affordable price. Whether you use it live or in the studio, the DMP3 is one of those pieces of gear destined to be integral in defining your sound.
An astounding frequency response of 20Hz to 100kHz makes the DMP3 ideal for today’s 96k recording work—and the perfect companion for the M-Audio Delta line of PCI audio interface cards. High and low gain controls accommodate a wide range of microphone and instrument levels, offering up to a substantial 66dB of gain. And the classic VU meters are just one indication of the soul you’ll find in the DMP3’s sound.

Features
• 2-channel preamp with XLR microphone inputs and 1/4” instrument inputs accommodates any type of audio signal
• Balanced outputs on TRS jacks deliver hum-free professional audio
• Low harmonic distortion (THD + N: .002% @ 1kHz) for ultra-clean sound
• Exceptional dynamic range to capture all the nuances of your music
• 20Hz to 100kHz frequency response (+0/-1dB) ideal for 96k digital recording
• High and low gain range controls offer up to 66dB of gain
• Clip LED for visual feedback of detrimental levels
• Low-cut filters remove unwanted rumble and hum
• Phantom power to accommodate all types of microphones
• Phase reverse switch on each channel insures optimal recordings

All of these great DMP3 features are brought to you by M-Audio, one of the most trusted companies in audio technology today. In fact, the DMP3 is based on the same DMP2 technology that won Pro Audio Review’s highest rating. Welcome to the M-Audio DMP3—professional sound quality made affordable.

[ This Message was edited by: braincell on 2003-12-01 16:43 ]

arela · Post by **arela** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 5:48 pm

It's Joe Meek VC3 - look at http://www.joemeek.com
Sold by PMI audio - http://www.pmiaudio.com/
Think they are renamed (and prob rebuildt) Joemeek MQ3 now

[ This Message was edited by: arela on 2003-12-01 17:50 ]

zezappa · Post by **zezappa** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 9:55 pm

On 2003-12-01 17:48, arela wrote:
It's Joe Meek VC3 - Think they are renamed (and prob rebuildt) Joemeek MQ3 now

the "real one" is P3
http://www.tfpro.com ...seems nice stuf

AndreD · Post by **AndreD** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 6:00 am

http://www.dbxpro.com/MiniPre.htm

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:02 pm

http://www.fmraudio.com/

These guys kick ass. The RNP & RNC are cheap, portable, and clean. Very under-dog-style products, but are probably more versatile than your standard channel strip or Vocal processor. Plus, at 1/3 rack size, you could, in 2Us pile up a six channel pre/comp rig that would beat the crap out of anything comparitively priced.

I've been tossing and turning as to whether I should buy a Manley Langevin or a couple of these puppies. Not that I have the money at the moment either way.

Sam

spacef · Post by **spacef** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:20 pm

Joe Meek doesn't have Ted Fletcher anymore, who founded http://www.tfpro.com/ where, in my opinion, you can find the latest "joemeek" stuff.
this is really a good thing http://www.tfpro.com/products/info/1.php
you really don't need more to record microphone.
You have all the preamps here http://www.tfpro.com/products/index.php

[ This Message was edited by: spacef on 2003-12-02 14:22 ]

Post by **garyb** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 9:58 pm

hey dehuszar,i have a langevin and it's great.i'd bet you wouldn't lose with a really nice pre either though.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Wed Dec 03, 2003 12:24 pm

Thanks guys, I will look into all of these. If anyone else has any ideas, I'll be checking back. Going to make a purchase next month.

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Wed Dec 03, 2003 12:53 pm

I quite like my TL Audio Fat2 valve preamp.. it's a bit bigger than the small Joe Meeks and the DBX mini-pre but it sounds very nice and has a decent (but not super-flexible) compressor onboard. The compression and the valve preamp stage both use one valve as far as I know, not entirely sure how it works but it sounds pretty good to my ears.

peace

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 3:29 pm

On 2003-12-02 21:58, garyb wrote:
hey dehuszar,i have a langevin and it's great.i'd bet you wouldn't lose with a really nice pre either though.

I hate you!

-jk-

Seriously though, if I had $1800 to drop at once, I'd without reservation get the Langevin. The Manley 'sound' is so buttery and beautiful. I really don't understand why the Avalon has gotten so much hype and hardly anyone knows about the Langevin (not dissin the Avalon mind you, just making a point).

The only thing that would deter me, is that my CW system is based around a laptop & Magma system, and I would want to be able to bring a set of pres with me. The Langevin is too heavy and delicate to lug around. The RNP and RNCs, on the other hand, are pretty rugged, light, and small.

My preference of course would be to get them all. One Langevin for home use, and 1U of RNPs, plus 1U of RNCs. 2Us, 6 channels, hallelujah.

I'll probably have to sell my ass in boystown to see any of this happen in the near future. <sniffle>

Sam

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 3:44 pm

On 2003-12-03 12:53, dArKr3zIn wrote:
I quite like my TL Audio Fat2 valve preamp.. it's a bit bigger than the small Joe Meeks and the DBX mini-pre but it sounds very nice and has a decent (but not super-flexible) compressor onboard. The compression and the valve preamp stage both use one valve as far as I know, not entirely sure how it works but it sounds pretty good to my ears.

peace

This is also what I use. It's great, but I find that it can make already thick tones like basses and elec-guitars kinda muddy if you don't go light on the gain.

Also I find that using compression on vocals sucks the dynamics right out, and makes singing "eeee's" (as in please) sound a little strained.

If used as a brick wall limiter with threshold just a touch over 0+db and recorded at 32bit, it sounds great. It is also, hands-down, one of the nices pre's for acoustic guitar I've ever heard. It just captures every floating harmonic and characteristic of my Ovation. Beautiful.

For the money though, I wouldn't buy it again, but go with an RNC&RNP combo.

It does certain things quite well though if you choose to ignore the presets and fiddle about a bit. I might be less hard on it if it didn't have fixed attack and release switch for the compressor.

It just colors everything in a not so spectacular way (except on my Ovation), that is hard to not make all your recordings sound 'hot' without really keeping the gain low and slamming the post stage. The RNCs and RNPs are much cleaner sounding to my ears.

I'd say the noise floor is comparible between the Fat-2 and the RNx's, but I haven't played with the RNx's in a while so I'm going from memory.

Also the FAT-2 uses a dual-triode tube. ...whatever the hell that means.

Sam

[ This Message was edited by: dehuszar on 2003-12-04 15:48 ]

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 9:09 pm

Yes Sam, you're absolutely right about it colouring the sound too much at non-conservative levels..

I kinda like this though really, I bought it as a cheap starter preamp which would be useful as a creative preamp in the future when I can afford a more 'hi-fi' pre.

peace

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 7:15 pm

As did I, and I don't regret it at all. In fact, the only reason I can relate my experiences with authority is cuz I've spent 3 years tinkering with the thing recording in various locations. So after a while, you start noticing where certain characteristics are consistant no matter what your recording environment.

I view it very much like the logic behind buying an Epiphone or Squire before a really nice guitar. Many of my DJ friends did the same with their decks. They bought some crappy belt drive tables and once they were able to make that sound good, and do beat matching on imprecise decks, then they could upgrade to some Technics and leap forwards skillwise.

Now I say this all in hindsight, and I certainly don't equate the FAT-2 to an Epiphone, merely, the concept is the same. I think the first pre shouldn't be a Manley, Avalon, or Oram/Trident. I think buying something like that the first time around can prevent one from reaching those 'sky is the limit' epiphanies that come from years of doing the best one could with not as much.

I guess what I'm really driving at is, no matter what anyone does in any situation musical or otherwise, you will inevitably look back on it and think of how you would've done it differently, knowing now what you didn't when making the original decision. I think they call it getting older.

Whoever started this thread.... buy whatever you think is best, you'll inevitably want to replace it in 3-5 years.

Food 4 thunk,
Sam

p.s. I'd still keep the FAT-2 for my Ovation unless I really found the Langevin covered that base well enough. And even then I'd wait a couple of months and then do a comparison again just to see if I'd regret parting with it. I'm having real separation anxiety with my K2500 right now. I never really use it anymore but since I dove into the CW platform I never felt like I needed to learn how to flex it either.

It's a glorified 88 key controller at this point. I may go through and sample off the cool patches just so I don't have to reinvent the songs I use it in, but who knows how well it will retain it's character. Anyway this is getting way off topic and reaching truly retarded lengths for a 'p.s.', so I'm outta here. Peas yall!

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 10:29 am

What's the deal with the Fatman-2? Most online shops only carry the Fatman-1 and when I do see the Fatman-2 it is way more expensive than the Fatman-1. Is there some sort of distrubution problem with it? Samedaymusic.com said they never heard of the Fatman-2. This is strange.

I heard the Fatman-2 tends to muffle the high end of microphones a little? Is this true?

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 3:08 pm

I wouldn't say muffle... just that it boosts the uppermids and the tube stage already makes things hot sounding.

The Fatman 1 is a stereo compressor. The Fat 2 is a mono mic pre & comp.

Anyway.

Sam

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Sun Dec 07, 2003 9:51 am

Right, a compressor would be good to have too. The Fatman-2 seems tempting.