luna card = bad deal

Fritz · Post by **Fritz** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 5:31 am

Hi,

I got Luna II card , i want to know how can i use the vocodizer on one of my cubase sx vst instruments channle ??
can someone plz explain me the what benefits do i get if i change the ASIO source or destination from 2 to 8 for example ??
I already read the manuals ,but it doesn't explained well there ...
(sorry for my bad english)

btw :
this luna card with the 3 dsp chips is not worth to buy , if i insert some of the eefects to my project it goes 100% , so what's the point with this dsp !?!?!?
i prefer use vst eefects...
lets say i wanna buy some good synth from the creamware shop like the SB-404 , can i run it with the luna II card ?

I think buying the luna at 450$ was a bad idea !
maybe i don't know about all this sfp projects but it seems that 1 eq and 1 compressor (the one i got with my card) will take 100 of the 3 chips ?

am i right or not ?

I wanna hear your opinion
Thanx

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 5:48 am

so what's the point with this dsp

The Luna is a basic entry level card. You can load any synth or any effect, or some modular patch with basic effect to name a couple of things. You can do a basic mix with hardware and ASIO IO. It has the same AD/DA as the big cards, so good quality. Want to try more at the same time? Add a bigger card.

This should be in General I believe...

Fritz · Post by **Fritz** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 6:40 am

Thanx for the reply ...

so it was a bad idea

if i had know i would buy some big card in the first place ...

so the only way using synth like : SB-404 , Minimax , Vectron ... is to buy other card with more dsp chips ???

thanks

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 11:57 am

I'm quite sure you can load those synths on a Luna, and play with them, although with reduced polyphony.

For example, Alfonso and myself once made Flexosaurus, a monster both DSP and soundwise IMHO, but it's reported to fit on a Luna. Although it can be set to a couple polyphony, we built it to be monophonical so yes, you can have that baby screaming and growling on your Luna. There is no such device in the native world, so with your Luna you have the opportunity to play it... if you have the keys for Flexor and Mod3 of course. Anyone know of a synth that is more heavy on DSP or cannot be loaded on a Luna card?

If you need more DSP, not IO or keys, keep an eye on the Scope Purchasing forum or Ebay for SRB's, DSP farms that give you more power without having to pay for new keys, IO, etc. They go relatively cheap, compared to the full bloated decks...

arela · Post by **arela** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 1:17 pm

hi
I did work the same way with 3dsp (powersampler), as i do today, with 9dsp.
I record synths, 1,2 or 3 at a time to wave, untill i got all tracks done.
Then ad dsp demanding effects if needed,
then mix all wave tracks

so it was a bad idea?

NOOO

But ofcourse, it take some time.

ChrisWerner · Post by **ChrisWerner** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 3:00 pm

I have to agree with you Fritz, a CW card with only three DSPs is not worth the money.
I have a pulsar 1 with a SRB board since some years now and I never produced a track with CW stuff.
I want to use those nice CW synths, because they are very good, also the effect and of course the modular but 8DSPs are not enough to run a whole production.
I only use one or two synths from CW togehter with the vst stuff. To record only one synth and then the other etc. that´s to time-consuming for my taste.
The time will come when the native things will be as good in quality as the dsp things, in the near future.
Only 3DSPs? No way....

But you have the lovely route functions that comes with CW cards. To use your vocodizer, just route it between your ASIO source channel and the mixer.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ChrisWerner on 2004-06-24 16:06 ]</font>

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:53 pm

On 2004-06-24 16:00, ChrisWerner wrote:
I have to agree with you Fritz, a CW card with only three DSPs is not worth the money.
...

I kindly disagree

you can have a trustworthy Minimoog emulation (the Mini is mono by default...) on that card plus IO routing and very good sound conversion

you can run 6 instances of Transient Designer, compare the hardware price

with VDAT you can build a HD recorder capable of at least 24 32bit tracks simulaneously on a box for 500 bucks - or at least 48 tracks on a 'regular' current machine.

it's a good investment because if you want (or need) more processing power (or IOs) you can simply add it to your system - you don't have to rebuild.
But keep in mind that the 450 Euro aren't just for a piece of hardware, the software is what finally makes the value, oops, I'm repeating myself

cheers, Tom

blazesboylan · Post by **blazesboylan** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:20 pm

3 DSPs is enough for some of us.

As a home recording/mixing studio solution (mixer + dynamics + effects) the 3 DSP cards are fantastic. I've never regretted the money I spent on my Luna 2 (which was about 50% higher in 2001 than it is now).

I used to record 8 tracks of band auditions, pumped through dynamics, effects and mixers etc. My biggest complaint: the Luna is *too* good. My "native" software (Vegas Audio at the time) would crash, and Windoze would lock up. But SFP would keep going. We'd still be getting a perfect mix, even though nothing was being recorded. I would return to the computer only to find the screen had frozen.

I still use my Luna II for 32 channels of IO, which is pretty amazing for such a cheap card.

I do understand being frustrated by lack of DSPs. But no matter how many you get, you'll always be craving more. Cf. the recent thread on people wanting 4 cards in 1 machine!

Start saving up for a 14 DSP card.

It's worth it. In the meantime, work with what you've got, limitations and all. Sometimes the best discoveries are made when you're trying to figure out how to get from A to B without maxing out your card.

There are always easier-to-use solutions. But 1) they don't sound as good and 2) they don't give you the flexibility that SCOPE does.

Now as to one of your original questions Fritz (sorry I can't answer the one about the Vocodizer):

Using more channels of ASIO gives you routing flexibility. For example, you can send 2 channels from your ADAT Source to Cubase via ASIO Dest. Then send a stero synth output to Cubase via 2 more ASIO Dest channels. Play back 4 stereo pre-recorded tracks on 8 ASIO Source channels, put them through an SFP mixer with dynamics and / or effects inserts. And so on. The benefits are limited only by one's imagination -- limitless!

Good luck with it Fritz,

Johann

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:54 pm

Of course you won't run a collection of synths and effects on a Luna. Nor will you do this on a Pulsar. But CWA cards are really a hardware solution and compared with a buying a single hardware synth or effect I think they represent very good value.

The answer is to work in audio, not midi. Load a synth, record it, delete. Also you might run a single good reverb - this alone can take a huge stress off your CPU for other native effects and devices.

Also, what other card would you have bought ? Maybe something a little cheaper with no available synths or effects ?

Cheer up, you haven't made a mistake.

Post by **Guest** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 3:43 pm

Luna is a good starter card and is not a bad idea.

If you bought Scope14 FSP ($2000) and found out that is not for you then you got stuck,

However if you tried Luna and you think you need more Power and DSP then you simply add an SRB or another card for the power.

Luna card as an I/O is not that bad but to use is as the only DSP card to process power it is not enough.

You may need to add an SRB (6 or 14). With a new SRB you will be also the option to get either the mix n master or the synth n sampler with it.

BingoTheClowno · Post by **BingoTheClowno** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 3:48 pm

I've got a SRB board recently, how do I get one of the packs? I did not see anything in My Page section.

Plato · Post by **Plato** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 4:07 pm

I don't think you get the packs with SRB (although I got reduced price Optimaster with mine as a special offer).....you have to buy one of the cards with I/Os for that.

BingoTheClowno · Post by **BingoTheClowno** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 4:25 pm

I don't know, even my dealer told me in his last email that I "should" be elegible for a soft pack. But my understanding too was that the SRBs are not eligible for plugin packs.

Post by **Guest** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 5:22 pm

Only newly purchased SRB's produced after April 2004 are eligible. I may be wrong but I heard this somewhere on this forum

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Sat Jun 26, 2004 2:34 pm

For me the Luna II was a logical purchase since I had the Pulsar I and the SRB I. The Luna brought the latency up to the newer standard. I have 11 DSP chips and that seems to be the right number for me. It's been an expensive investment but a nice one. If I was buying all that today there are other optionsI might consider rather than go with Creamware.

H-Rave · Post by **H-Rave** » Wed Dec 14, 2005 1:14 pm

I've Got Three luna cards chained up = 9 dsps the first card I had problems with,the second I bought for 150euros and the third I bought for three hundred euros with the 2496 I/O box!!! all I can say is people who think Creamware and their cards are a ripoff is,"no you're right you'd have to pay me to take it off you ".

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 2:36 am

I doubt if John Bowen's amazing 'Quantum Wave' which he released recently would run on a single 3 DSP card. If I'm not mistaken it's recommended entry level is 6 DSP, so I can't see it running on 3.

I must say that I'm also pretty surprised that Creamware have now bundled the bigger mixers from the M&M pack with the Luna when you take the wonderfull 4.5 upgrade.

I'm affraid having an STM 4896 on a single 3 dsp Luna card is like putting an african elephant in a friggin mini cooper & expecting to be able to ask it to move over & make space for a hippo.

samplaire · Post by **samplaire** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 2:52 am

Shroomz,

It's difficult to satisfy everybody

Some time ago there were moans that Luna cards were bundled ONLY with a compressor, equalizer and 2 mixers. In those times everybody shouted that CW should bundle more plugins with Luna cards to stimulate people to buy more cards... In my opinion the bundled software which comes with new Scope Home is fair and if you don't want (or cannot) just don't use it. I wouldn't want CW to return to the old policy...

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:24 am

Samplair I'm not unsatisfied at all. We're very happy with our CW gear (including several Luna cards). It makes perfect sense for Creamware to have beefed up the Luna software bundle. A single Luna card on it's own however, is not the place to be trying to run an STM 4896, Minimax & Masterverb Pro though, is it?

samplaire · Post by **samplaire** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 4:01 am

On 2005-12-15 03:24, Shroomz wrote:
A single Luna card on it's own however, is not the place to be trying to run an STM 4896, Minimax & Masterverb Pro though, is it?

Why not? I'm not telling you to use the mixer (or Minimax) with one Luna but for test purposes (before buying a larger card) it's comfortable to have your own plugin instead of just a demo version. I don't know how Minimax behaves with one Luna but if it works with even just one voice, I think, there are people who would make great use of it. What I want to say is having is better than not having something.

_________________

Sir samplaire scopernicus
Haiku Fristajl (in Polish)
"Those are blind who don't use Scope" SSS

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: samplaire on 2005-12-15 04:02 ]</font>