GaryB............
Here's the one I will need to run VE3 & XITE-1.
Fusion I/O's are ticket 2 years from now, and this board was made with those in mind.
The i7 Nehalem EP's can be the lower speed binned models.
6GB's of DDRIII 1600 for each CPU.
Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
XITE-1/4LIVE wrote:GaryB............
Here's the one I will need to run VE3 & XITE-1.
Fusion I/O's are ticket 2 years from now, and this board was made with those in mind.
The i7 Nehalem EP's can be the lower speed binned models.
6GB's of DDRIII 1600 for each CPU.
if you buy that i guarantee that the next week they will announce the 8 core xeon/i7
its completely overkill anyways.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
It isn't really if you see what the Vienna String guys have been working on.
Assignable cores, enitre cues as a single template, hosting of any other VST, AU & RTAS applications.
12GB's of DDRIII 1600 using the fast 2GB modules instead of the newer slow 4GB DIMM's is paramount to a large fast template.
These are designed for the 1366 Xeon i7's.
No longer is having several slaves and a master DAW necessary.
For guys who have this many slaves there's no advantage to going for an 8 core just yet, but everyone would prefer a single solution eventually.
Vienna has even included built in networking and can unhook plugged in DAW's like a hot pluggable SATA HDD.
Many new and incredible solutions to problems Mac guys have been having for years.
Almost makes me wanna go Mac, but I'll settle for the same or better hardware for a couple large less.
Actually having the i7's at 3.0GHz or higher is a waste of power, but 8 cores and 16 threads at 2.23 GHz is what's making all of the Mac/Film composer guys go nutty.
Assignable cores, enitre cues as a single template, hosting of any other VST, AU & RTAS applications.
12GB's of DDRIII 1600 using the fast 2GB modules instead of the newer slow 4GB DIMM's is paramount to a large fast template.
These are designed for the 1366 Xeon i7's.
No longer is having several slaves and a master DAW necessary.
For guys who have this many slaves there's no advantage to going for an 8 core just yet, but everyone would prefer a single solution eventually.
Vienna has even included built in networking and can unhook plugged in DAW's like a hot pluggable SATA HDD.
Many new and incredible solutions to problems Mac guys have been having for years.
Almost makes me wanna go Mac, but I'll settle for the same or better hardware for a couple large less.
Actually having the i7's at 3.0GHz or higher is a waste of power, but 8 cores and 16 threads at 2.23 GHz is what's making all of the Mac/Film composer guys go nutty.
Last edited by dawman on Fri Apr 03, 2009 4:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
...but your local electricity company will love youNeutron wrote:its completely overkill anyways.
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I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
Actuall the TDP of such a DAW is much cheaper than the DualQuad Macs running 4 slaves w/ Giga/VST's.
My local power company loves me already as they raise my bill every month by a 1/2 %, and CAP & Trade laws will ensure this love affair forever as my bills will increase by 40% within 2 years.........
I shall be doing dishes by hand w/ cold water and only flush the toilet at the end of the day....
I went w/o heat this winter and wore more clothes just to see a decrease in the bill,...to no avail.
Studio comes first, then creature comforts....
My local power company loves me already as they raise my bill every month by a 1/2 %, and CAP & Trade laws will ensure this love affair forever as my bills will increase by 40% within 2 years.........
I shall be doing dishes by hand w/ cold water and only flush the toilet at the end of the day....
I went w/o heat this winter and wore more clothes just to see a decrease in the bill,...to no avail.
Studio comes first, then creature comforts....
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
wouldn't you prefer some mathematicians and AI and smart people figure out how to generate those sound real time rather than pumping money and CPU power to the dead end "rompler"
if you keep paying for bigger and more cpu wasteful ones they will make even bigger and more cpu wasteful ones.
if you keep paying for bigger and more cpu wasteful ones they will make even bigger and more cpu wasteful ones.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
I totally agree as PianoTeq has proven it can be done.
But these chaps have had years to do so and haven't shown any alternatives I am aware of.
And because of recent events where I will be needing to do Orchestral Mock Ups I have no alternative.
I never really liked sampled strings except for Cresendo sustained samples and certain Pizzacatos, but VSL has really excelled year after year with quality in sound and performance orientated instruments, so I am game for other alternatives. But their instruments are proven and ready where as other methods are on hold. I must be ready by Fall to audition my work and won't even have the scores to prepare until summer.
So the sooner I learn how to use these live the better prepared I will be.
I will disable all of the effects and fake mic placements that plague these applications though.
I can use DynaPara or Master It EQ to create my own mic placements using M/S EQ's and a combination of hardware and DSP based reverbs instead of those intolerable IR's.
This means that I could probably use a single i7, but the benefit of 12GB's of fast DDRIII 2GB DIMM's running at 1600MHz would be negated, so I am going for it.
Hell I can't even wait for SFP to be 64bit, so an RME ADAT card will be used, and the XITE-1 will easily be networked and run from a cheap Core2Duo laptop.
If I get the gig, the gear's cost becomes invalid, if I fail, oh well I will have one Hell of a live rig. It's win / win for me, even though I will surely go broke again.
Nothing's certain in my life except for the continuous battle of making a living playing muisc.
If I would have had XITE-1 at Christmas time, I could have been a contender...........
But these chaps have had years to do so and haven't shown any alternatives I am aware of.
And because of recent events where I will be needing to do Orchestral Mock Ups I have no alternative.
I never really liked sampled strings except for Cresendo sustained samples and certain Pizzacatos, but VSL has really excelled year after year with quality in sound and performance orientated instruments, so I am game for other alternatives. But their instruments are proven and ready where as other methods are on hold. I must be ready by Fall to audition my work and won't even have the scores to prepare until summer.
So the sooner I learn how to use these live the better prepared I will be.
I will disable all of the effects and fake mic placements that plague these applications though.
I can use DynaPara or Master It EQ to create my own mic placements using M/S EQ's and a combination of hardware and DSP based reverbs instead of those intolerable IR's.
This means that I could probably use a single i7, but the benefit of 12GB's of fast DDRIII 2GB DIMM's running at 1600MHz would be negated, so I am going for it.
Hell I can't even wait for SFP to be 64bit, so an RME ADAT card will be used, and the XITE-1 will easily be networked and run from a cheap Core2Duo laptop.
If I get the gig, the gear's cost becomes invalid, if I fail, oh well I will have one Hell of a live rig. It's win / win for me, even though I will surely go broke again.
Nothing's certain in my life except for the continuous battle of making a living playing muisc.
If I would have had XITE-1 at Christmas time, I could have been a contender...........
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
they made a new AI "scientist" which they gave experimental results of pendulum, dropping object and things like that.
it came up the the law of "conservation of energy" in a few minutes. not half a lifetime like newton.
get ready for skynet..i hope they like synth music! and let us live!
it came up the the law of "conservation of energy" in a few minutes. not half a lifetime like newton.
get ready for skynet..i hope they like synth music! and let us live!
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
The new Nehelem based Xeons are actually incredibly unwasteful, as far as cpu cycles & energy consumption goes. At least if you compare it to previous generation Xeons and not a single socket i7 board. Overall power consumption with the new chips is about 100w less, both due to the highly aggressive methods of clocking each core up & down as needed and because FB-DIMMs are no longer required in the current Xeons (which sucked a LOT of juice in previous high end boards).
If I hadn't built this Xeon box last year I'd be upgrading now, and this i8 Xeon current platform will be good for at least 2 years so I may buy into one yet...
But anyway I still don't think even the i7 consumer boards are a 'necessary' upgrade for anyone running a core2 era system. If your machine is 3-4 years old though my my are you in for a treat when you upgrade...
If I hadn't built this Xeon box last year I'd be upgrading now, and this i8 Xeon current platform will be good for at least 2 years so I may buy into one yet...
But anyway I still don't think even the i7 consumer boards are a 'necessary' upgrade for anyone running a core2 era system. If your machine is 3-4 years old though my my are you in for a treat when you upgrade...
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
a car using less fuel than a tank isn't necessarily evironmentally friendly...XITE-1/4LIVE wrote:Actuall the TDP of such a DAW is much cheaper than the DualQuad Macs running 4 slaves w/ Giga/VST's.
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I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
cars aren't the real environmental hazard. they're just an easy target. computers might be....
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
man is, certainly.garyb wrote:cars aren't the real environmental hazard. they're just an easy target. computers might be....
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I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
man?
or some men?
if it was "man", then we'd already been extinct for thousands of years.
most just go with the flow. some profit from waste. it's cities that are the real destructive force, unfortunately...
or some men?
if it was "man", then we'd already been extinct for thousands of years.
most just go with the flow. some profit from waste. it's cities that are the real destructive force, unfortunately...
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
man, woman... who cares?
and that man didn't extinct himself is just because he didn't use his full potential yet.
anyway, we're already way off topic...
and that man didn't extinct himself is just because he didn't use his full potential yet.
anyway, we're already way off topic...
--
I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
This motherboard is the cap & trade special....
Massive power to run 17GB RAM templates for Rompler Room finatics.
Many composers are using a Mac and 3-4 PC slaves, this would be more efficient.
Since I use everyone else's power, I could care less as long as it's their dime.
Even with the i7 W5570 Laptop using SSD's the battery life is 1 hour, and the laptop I recently priced is 5400 USD !!!! But this a serious investment and only worth buying if you actually plan on making money with it.
The above motherboard is actually useful for one reason, running a large RAM footprint.
Running a giant template for one pass recordings or playback of an Orchestral Mockup is achievable for a decent price only because of the ability to assign cores, and 12 DIMM's of 2GB DDRIII RAM. The 4GB DIMM's are extremely expensive and impradtical to use at this point.
The 8 core Mac I get to witness in use hardly uses the 8 cores.
This mobo is just a much cheaper alternative to buying the Mac OctaCore.
IMHO it's a showboat that is unecessary.
Using Vienna Ensemble 3.0 one can customize his performance by purging samples that won't be needed, and deleting those God awful effects that chew up a CPU.
My idea is that a laptop could handle this using eSATA drives, or a single motherboard that packs 6 x 2GB DIMM's for 12GB worth of RAM.
The trick is the actual template being used more efficiently.
Most of these giant libraries are hardly used but are a hassle to purge and program. I don't have a problem with that, and if I was using a template that was part of a certain production where you knew which parts could be deleted are used the same way every night, I could swing this w/ a single Quad core W5570.
Deleting all of those worthless IR's and false mic positions is a snap. Hardware reverb and dozens of M/S EQ's for custom creation of depth, which is what these quacky mic positions are anyways.
The below config is perfect for a well designed rig and isn't too overly expensive, and the 4 cores would be better used. 8 cores never went higher than 10-15% with effects ( yecchhh ) and Molasses enabled. So I watched this beast of a machine impress all of the children but I was thinking of a work around the whole time.
Guys who use Scope cards and their effects or hardware based effects can easily do what the OctoCore Macs can do. The guys who just load the entire libraries and use the effects are lazy, and talk themselves into believing that the effects are good so trhat don't have to do much work. It's a;; about speed and workflow and cutting the project cue time in half.
Understandable too. Since I wouldn't be on a deadline but rather the best quality sound I could achieve, the extra effects, cores and Molasses would be purged from my project.
I love that word purged....It's very suitable sounding, and gives the impression that the data being purged is wasted FAT and worthy of elimination.
Massive power to run 17GB RAM templates for Rompler Room finatics.
Many composers are using a Mac and 3-4 PC slaves, this would be more efficient.
Since I use everyone else's power, I could care less as long as it's their dime.
Even with the i7 W5570 Laptop using SSD's the battery life is 1 hour, and the laptop I recently priced is 5400 USD !!!! But this a serious investment and only worth buying if you actually plan on making money with it.
The above motherboard is actually useful for one reason, running a large RAM footprint.
Running a giant template for one pass recordings or playback of an Orchestral Mockup is achievable for a decent price only because of the ability to assign cores, and 12 DIMM's of 2GB DDRIII RAM. The 4GB DIMM's are extremely expensive and impradtical to use at this point.
The 8 core Mac I get to witness in use hardly uses the 8 cores.
This mobo is just a much cheaper alternative to buying the Mac OctaCore.
IMHO it's a showboat that is unecessary.
Using Vienna Ensemble 3.0 one can customize his performance by purging samples that won't be needed, and deleting those God awful effects that chew up a CPU.
My idea is that a laptop could handle this using eSATA drives, or a single motherboard that packs 6 x 2GB DIMM's for 12GB worth of RAM.
The trick is the actual template being used more efficiently.
Most of these giant libraries are hardly used but are a hassle to purge and program. I don't have a problem with that, and if I was using a template that was part of a certain production where you knew which parts could be deleted are used the same way every night, I could swing this w/ a single Quad core W5570.
Deleting all of those worthless IR's and false mic positions is a snap. Hardware reverb and dozens of M/S EQ's for custom creation of depth, which is what these quacky mic positions are anyways.
The below config is perfect for a well designed rig and isn't too overly expensive, and the 4 cores would be better used. 8 cores never went higher than 10-15% with effects ( yecchhh ) and Molasses enabled. So I watched this beast of a machine impress all of the children but I was thinking of a work around the whole time.
Guys who use Scope cards and their effects or hardware based effects can easily do what the OctoCore Macs can do. The guys who just load the entire libraries and use the effects are lazy, and talk themselves into believing that the effects are good so trhat don't have to do much work. It's a;; about speed and workflow and cutting the project cue time in half.
Understandable too. Since I wouldn't be on a deadline but rather the best quality sound I could achieve, the extra effects, cores and Molasses would be purged from my project.
I love that word purged....It's very suitable sounding, and gives the impression that the data being purged is wasted FAT and worthy of elimination.
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
kylie wrote:man, woman... who cares?
and that man didn't extinct himself is just because he didn't use his full potential yet.
anyway, we're already way off topic...
yup, we are.
hey man, stop hating on yourself. man is just as likely to be the environment's friend. not everything will live in any case. i can't stand seeing rhetoric repeated that is merely programming and half truths, sorry, no offense meant in sticking up for you and your kind...
Jim, i hear you, and obey. just one thing...the battery life on the laptop isn't an issue. you can't be doing audio work on a battery on any laptop, really.....
Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
1) I do not hate myselfgaryb wrote:hey man, stop hating on yourself. man is just as likely to be the environment's friend.kylie wrote:man, woman... who cares?
and that man didn't extinct himself is just because he didn't use his full potential yet.
2) man can be environment's friend, for sure. and he can be its enemy. feel free to think different
3) I tend to have my own opinion on things. and I know you're fine with that. I nevertheless may be wrong on things (and I know you're even fine with that).
4) pm me if you feel there are things to be said. this is not about 8 core macs anymore...
-greetings, markus-
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I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
I'm sorry, but my karma just ran over your dogma.
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ScofieldKid
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Re: Cheap Alternative To 8 Core Macs
Watch out for the memory restrictions on the new stuff. The design docs are all saying: 3 udimms -> 1333, 6 udimms -> 1066. Same on the 5520 chipset. So it looks like you will have to balance dimm counts based on CPU and total memory requirements.