Sonic Core announces Scope 5!

[braincell]

Anyone who buys the Scope Home card gets a code to get 5 free for free. I don't care about version 4.5.

The Scope Home costs $399 USD (with 3 DSP chips)
Upgrade Costs $310 USD (plus shipping)


http://www.musiciansfriend.com/navigation?q=scope+home

Gary am I right about this?

I will pay a little extra to have 3 more chips. This will be the 5th card I bought. The two type one cards are in another computer. I guess they will end up not being used since I would have to pay an arm and a leg to get version 5 for them. Sonic Core is taking a lead from Microsoft by screwing people with their DRM. Love the way people assume if it's in 2 computers, two people are using it. In the old days, you buy software, you do what you want with it. Now they have you by the balls. Nobody else will be developing a Scope platform.

[kylie]

Anyone who buys the Scope Home card gets a code to get 5 free for free.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/navigation?q=scope+home

I would definitely check whether the 399 USD package contains scope 4.5 or not. I did not see a single line mentioning 4.5 in the product description.

the scope home 4.5 package was introduced when software 4.5 was released. it was a bundle of the existing scope home card with 4.0, the optional adat expansion and the scope 4.5 license.

if they sell a single scope home (which maybe NOS) it is possible that it comes without the 4.5 license, thus you'd be not eligible for 5.0 for free.

the other pack (for 500 usd) is explicitly sold as the bundle mentioned above. you get the adat expansion for half the price plus 4.5. I'd get that, if I were you...

-greetings, markus-

[reflex]

In the old days, you buy software, you do what you want with it. Now they have you by the balls.

I worked for a software company in "the good old days" that was put out of business by people stealing their unprotected programs. Sadly, some means of controlling licenses is required to keep people from taking all they can get without paying.

The Scope market is tiny, therefore Holger and Juergen cannot charge extremely low prices. Why should Sonic Core provide you with incredibly cheap software because you paid Creamware for earlier versions in the past? You're ignoring the fact that they're two completely different companies, and that Sonic Core has to make money somehow, or they will cease to exist.

You seem determined to obtain Sonic Core's new product without paying them for it, which stinks.

[braincell]

I'll check with Sonic Core. If it's not free, their website is wrong. It says on their site anyone who buys one of their cards now gets the upgrade free.

Anyone who buys the Scope Home card gets a code to get 5 free for free.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/navigation?q=scope+home

I would definitely check whether the 399 USD package contains scope 4.5 or not. I did not see a single line mentioning 4.5 in the product description.

the scope home 4.5 package was introduced when software 4.5 was released. it was a bundle of the existing scope home card with 4.0, the optional adat expansion and the scope 4.5 license.

if they sell a single scope home (which maybe NOS) it is possible that it comes without the 4.5 license, thus you'd be not eligible for 5.0 for free.

the other pack (for 500 usd) is explicitly sold as the bundle mentioned above. you get the adat expansion for half the price plus 4.5. I'd get that, if I were you...

-greetings, markus-

[braincell]

I have no problem with them charging money for the SFP (although I think it's a high price). It's an unfortunate result that users have to buy another copy for each computer (to use Version 5). Some companies have DRM, some don't. I prefer no DRM. We all know that other companies such as Native Instruments and Steinberg Jones have DRM and they are usually cracked within days of their release so the DRM only hurts honest customers. Some people argue they got so big because of the cracks. A good number of people use them to demo the software and most others would not have bought it at any price ever so I fail to see how it is a loss.

It would be really nice if they let you install it on two cards. Imagine you go sell sell a card on ebay and keep another one. Now you will have to explain oh by the way if you want this to work on Vista, you have to pay Sonic Whore over $300 more. They just made our extra used boards worthless. Thanks Sonic Whore!

It's really no surprise because companies almost never look at things from a customer's perspective.

In the old days, you buy software, you do what you want with it. Now they have you by the balls.

I worked for a software company in "the good old days" that was put out of business by people stealing their unprotected programs. Sadly, some means of controlling licenses is required to keep people from taking all they can get without paying.

The Scope market is tiny, therefore Holger and Juergen cannot charge extremely low prices. Why should Sonic Core provide you with incredibly cheap software because you paid Creamware for earlier versions in the past? You're ignoring the fact that they're two completely different companies, and that Sonic Core has to make money somehow, or they will cease to exist.

You seem determined to obtain Sonic Core's new product without paying them for it, which stinks.

[kylie]

I'll check with Sonic Core. If it's not free, their website is wrong. It says on their site anyone who buys one of their cards now gets the upgrade free.

no. they say:

The software update will be free available for you, if...

* you bought SCOPE 4.5 until the 31th of december 2007
* or you buy SCOPE 4.5 up from the 1st of january 2008 at SONIC CORE and with that, you got your special update code from us for free
* or you buy SCOPE 4.5 up from the 1st of january 2008 (including a SCOPE PCI board) at one of our distribution partners

1) musiciansfriend is one of their listed retailers. ok.
2) the card you intend to buy does obviously not contain a 4.5 license. it's not the product called "Scope Home 4.5". sorry.
3) there is not a word on the SC website that any card sold anywhere in the world now is automatically licensed to 4.5. sorry again.

"..if you buy SCOPE 4.5.." is not "..if you buy a creamware/soniccore dsp card.."

you can, indeed, waste your money on that offer, but still I recommend buying the Scope Home 4.5 pack for a 100 usd more.
that's what provides you with a 4.5 license.
I'm kinda sure the other offer doesn't. ask musiciansfriend.

and, well, if not, it's neither my fault nor soniccores if you end up with 3 dsps more and no 4.5 license...

-greetings, markus-

[pollux]

I have no problem with them charging money for the software (although I think it's a high price). It's an unfortunate result that users have to buy another copy for each computer. Some companies have DRM, some don't. I prefer no DRM. We all know that other companies such as Native Instruments and Steinberg Jones have DRM and they are usually cracked within days of their release so the DRM only hurts honest customers. Some people argue they got so big because of the cracks. A good number of people use them to demo the software and most others would not have bought it at any price ever so I fail to see how it is a loss.

If you have win XP and you want to upgrade to Vista you have to pay
If you have Cubase 3 and you want to upgrade to Cubase 4 you have to pay
If you have Sonar 6 and you want to upgrade to Sonar 7 you have to pay
If you have Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5 and you want RHEL 6 you have to pay
......
could continue for hours
......

When you upgrade to SFP 4.5, you not only get the new software, but also get a big bunch of plugins that cost a lot more if you buy them sepparate.


The same happens with the amount of software licenses. You cannot use a single Windows or Office license on two machines, nor a single Cubase or Sonar license on two machines. Technically you can do it, but not legally.

As for the cracked versions, I see your point of view, and it can be valid in some cases.
The fact that anyone could have a "cracked" windows 3.0 at home is what made it a big hit in the corporate world when PCs became massively used. The same can apply to cakewalk or steinberg... It can even be called some form of "massive marketing", and it paid.
The case of SFP is different.. You can only run the software and the plugins if you own a specific hardware..
It means that if you have the card and use cracked software, you'll very unlikely buy it..
That has a big impact in SC's or the plugin developer's finances because it's not going to enlarge the user base in any way, but the very opposite, reduce it as the crack spreads.
As for using the same plugin on different cards on different computers, the same as before applies.. How could you prove that you're not using the two computers at the same time? or that you actually own both of them?

[braincell]

This is why hardware is good. You own what you buy. You never own software and are at the mercy of some corporation far away. Just because a lot of companies screw the customer, doesn't make it right.

I really have no issue with them tying the modules to the hardware but not the SFP. That is evil! Give people at least the basic stuff so that we can still sell some of our cards. Otherwise they will remain in the closet. You could not even give them away.

[hubird]

Thanks Sonic Whore!

you never hold back uh?

[Fluxpod]

All that whining about a few bucks= el oh el....

[braincell]

That was a typo.

Thanks Sonic Whore!

you never hold back uh?

[braincell]

You call $300 a few bucks? I fail to see how they should earn any money from used gear. Like I said, it will make some of our gear worthless. Nobody will be using XP in the future other than a few geeks.

All that whining about a few bucks= el oh el....

[kylie]

...and it could soon turn into more whining about some more bucks, spent wrong...

[pollux]

So? I could name a bunch of companies for which you don't have to pay. Native instruments allows you to install it on two computers. Other music companies use Syncrosoft. I love this method because I can put it on any computer I want without contacting them. I other companies use just a serial number.

The fact that the serial number allows you to install some software on two machines doesn't necessarily mean that you have the right to do it.. Nothing forces you to stop at a red light, and if there's no police officer around you won't get caught.. It does not mean you are not breaking the law.

This is why hardware is good. You own what you buy. You never own software and are at the mercy of some corporation far away. Just because a lot of companies screw the customer, doesn't make it right.

SCOPE cards are hardware, and come with a certain amount of functionnality implemented as plugins, so it's perfectly logic that they stay bundled to the card.

With a hardware device you can only use it in one place at the time, and if you want to use it somewhere else you have to move it and plug it in the second setup. Same applies to a SCOPE card.

Also, try to transfer a specific functionnality from a hardware box A to a hardware box B, say a reverb algo from a newer lexicon reverb to an older one

[braincell]

Alright, then try to sell a used Luna in the future to someone who uses Vista.

It's totally bogus. Either they didn't consider this or they are oblivious to customer satisfaction. If anyone wants to sell a card, you better do it quickly or you might get some angry email. I have my old cards in another computer. I was going to put Vista on that computer; If I do, I will no longer be able to use the cards. I paid a lot for those cards. This is totally not fair. I am not asking for all the modules, just the functionality I have now on those cards which is a mixing board, and some i/o modules that is all. I am not asking too much. They didn't have to tie all the new modules to the SFP 5.

If you can sell cards, then your customer will buy stuff from them. That is common sense. Don't argue with me just because you hate me.

[kylie]

The fact that the serial number allows you to install some software on two machines doesn't necessarily mean that you have the right to do it..

iirc NI really allows you to install it on two machines at the same time. you have to authorize them via challenge response via internet. I don't know exactly whether you are allowed to use the software concurrently, but I think no.

This is why hardware is good. You own what you buy. You never own software and are at the mercy of some corporation far away. Just because a lot of companies screw the customer, doesn't make it right.

SCOPE cards are hardware, and come with a certain amount of functionnality implemented as plugins, so it's perfectly logic that they stay bundled to the card.

it's not that easy, imho. scope is neither hardware only nor software only. that's what it makes different from all the manufacturers mentioned above.

btw, it's not so much different with UAD and Powercore. dsp plugins are (or were) licensed to a card or a bunch of (although there are some differences here and there).
if you sell one of your uads, you can decide if all additional plugins go away with it or not. if not, the buyer receives a card with the standard software.
powercore generates plugins bound to your hardware, too, iirc.
there are differences when you buy for instance sonnox plugins. they use ilok. I don't know if that means it is independent from a specific card. the ilok is imho used because the license is for both, powercore and native.

-greetings, markus-

[Fluxpod]

You call $300 a few bucks? I fail to see how they should earn any money from used gear. Like I said, it will make some of our gear worthless. Nobody will be using XP in the future other than a few geeks.

All that whining about a few bucks= el oh el....

Yes i do.....oh and win xp support is going till 2013.So i guess...well.

[braincell]

That's right and I can buy an OEM legal copy of Vista for roughly 1/3 the cost of the SFP 5. By the way, I have not seen any XP updates lately so define what you mean by "support".

[Fluxpod]

That's right and I can buy an OEM legal copy of Vista for roughly 1/3 the cost of the SFP 5.

Super....Point?

[braincell]

How many SFP 5 copies will you be buying?