Automating Scope with Ableton 6, Perfect Sync ???

[Stompa81]

Hey all

Sending Midi Automation to Scope from Ableton 6 is soooo Easy and sooo coool!! The only little problem I have is a bit of a delay, it is only a very small delay but i would love to know how to get it spot on.

I Use sequencer Midi Source to send midi into Modular to Automate knobs , Mainly filter cutoffs. In my style (hardcore , the dutch way ) it is a very common thing to do very rapid filter cutoff adjustments over Distorted kicks during Fills. During the fills the kicks usually around 170 BPM on a 1/8 triplet grid.If you looked at the automation envelope it would be stepping up and down.

1.Am I wasting my time relying on midi automation to rapidly adjust the cutoff ??
2. Would I be better off just Recording Each individual Filtered kick to audio .taking midi out of the picture??(would save me a great deal of time if i didn't have to do this, would allow for much more creativity as well)

I learnt a great way off the Adern Website to use an audio channel to sync the Flexor pattern LFO to ableton. Just set the FLEXOR Ramp to the desired BPM, record the OUT of the ramp to audio, then that audio back into modular and connect that Audio to the Gate input. The pattern Lfo stays perfectly in sync and now i am so in love with it

Is there a similar way to use an Audio channel to Sync Scope (or just modular) to ableton so that the automation is as close to sample accurate as possible??
Or does someone have a even better approach to automation??

Thanx for reading !! I hope it is possible to achieve such Supreme Syncronization Between these two platforms ... If it is possible I shall name it "SCOPLETON" OR "ABLETOPE"

[Shayne White]

I don't think it's an automation issue. If you're using one of the newer filters in the Modular, then the filter is probably using interpolation to get smooth filter sweeps and eliminate "stepping" or "zipping" noises from the low resolution of MIDI. It's great if you want smooth filter sweeps, not so great if you want instantaneous adjustments.

You can try one of the older filters from the Modular 2 days and see if that works better. They generally don't sound as good, though...

Shayne

P.S. Here's another idea...hook up a "Constant Val" module to the filter modulation input and automate that slider instead of the filter directly. That may work.

[Stompa81]

Thanks for the input

I can hear what you mean about the new filters, they do have a much smoother curve, I figured i would just draw the automation a few ms earlier to give it time to get to the desired value, its a pretty messy way to do it but it kind of works. I think recording samples is going to be the most accurate way.

I think there is some midi delay or something because even with the older filters it wont snap to the value instantly , its only a really small delay of a few ms , but its enough to notice it.

I will go try Constant Val now thanks for the tip ill let u know how it goes

Edit:- Constant Val Suggestion worked very well!! it seems to be changing values instanly now, however, there is still i minuscule bit of delay , but is far less noticable than before. I also Run an ASUS mohterboard which i hear can contribute to MIDI problems.
anyway, Thanks for improving my situation I think its at the point where its not really an issue anymore, I guess if i want 100% accuracy i should record samples

[BingoTheClowno]

The MIDI bandwith (i.e. transmission speed) is 31,250 bits per second (BPS). Therefore, because there are 10-bits in every MIDI "byte" (consisting of 1 start bit, 8 data bits, and 1 stop bit), the actual bytes which can be transmitted per second is 3,125. That converts to a delay between each byte of (1/3125) .00032 seconds or .32ms (milliseconds).

I think you're wasting your time relying on MIDI...

[Stompa81]

Well here is an example of what i was trying to Achieve. Shaynes Suggestion of using Constant Val has given me the best outcome i have Achieved yet

So Thanks again Shayne

http://www.speedyshare.com/942498223.html - Its dutch hardcore so it might not be too many peoples flavour but the filtered kicks are all automated via Midi.

[hubird]

the link just shows a questionmark in the Quicktime logo after a while...

[Stompa81]

just have to right click and save as once ur on the page . I don't know why it always tries to stream with quicktime from that site

[borg]

you know you can adjust midi timing in ableton live in the preferences globally?
and per track as well. you might not have noticed this, but on the right side where you have the tabs for xfade, in out, send return,... there's also a tab for track delay. click that and you can alter +/- time on a per track basis.
hope that helps.

[Stompa81]

Yeah I have played with it alot actually .. Doesnt really seem to work properly . I may be doing somethiing wrong but i fiddled with it for ages and doesnt really seem very accurate and constanly seems to change every time to play a clip even if u keep the same delay settings

But as i said i may be doing it the wrong way

[valis]

Drums and sample critical layering tasks I tend to do in software as it avoids such issues. If sound quality is paramount and midi is involved, I'll do my Scope (or analogue) processing and bounce it to audio and edit to get the bits that I like.

Almost all material that I generate these days winds up as audio or resampled into a software sampler. The only stuff that stays 'live' on my board or in scope is synth patches that act as backing parts (pads etc) or things that are not as time critical. And of course send effects etc where there is little to no time critical autoation involved...