you can let your breath out now...

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:57 pm

Schroomz wrote:If given a choice it would be PCIe for me too, but giving buyers a choice of either solution (pcie or firewire) might be the ideal eventual stance if thats at all possible.

Why not Firewire and eSATA - eSATA is twice as fast as Firewire800 - the more connectors the better.

Bifop · Post by **Bifop** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:11 am

You guys really are a bunch of hardcore enthusiasts !!

I'm as skeptical as St Thomas.
My wishes ; scope 5.0 with multicore support and enhanced bugfree XTC support.

erminardi · Post by **erminardi** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:14 am

Bifop wrote:My wishes ; scope 5.0 with multicore support and enhanced bugfree XTC support.

Ditto

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:29 am

I've always thought slapping a big fat load of RAM on the cards would make sense, you could then have e.g. reverbs running solely on the card with little or no PCI bus overhead

I'd like to see some minor tweaks to the software:

o Don't hide the menus behind devices when you drop them down! Have the menus appear *in front* of the devices (dur!)

o Allow Scope to start-up with the project of your choice, not always loading a default/start-up project which you then have to discard

o Mixer sends can be configured to be mono or stereo (I'm still not sure of the best way to route mono sends to a VST/DX effect, e.g. a reverb which sits on a stereo fx bus..? I often take the mono send signal through a little mixer to get a left & right channel to send over ASIO to effects running in Cubase).

o Improve the somewhat clunky behaviour / UI design of the STS Sampler series

On a completely different note, I'm doing some quiete interesting development work at the moment which is to do with the virtualisation of devices on a PCIe bus (and the virtualisation of the bus itself). You could have a PCIe Scope card containing many virtualised engines, each its own separate studio. Dunno if that's of any practical value, but it's damn funky tech!

Brazda lui Novac · Post by **Brazda lui Novac** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:36 am

Counterparts wrote: o Allow Scope to start-up with the project of your choice, not always loading a default/start-up project which you then have to discard

But you can already do that... unless you want it to ask you every time wich project to load, a la Cubase templates?

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:51 am

How can you do that?

e.g. I save "myproject.pro", how can I get scope to start-up and load that project?

I'd either like a choice (or configure scope to give me a choice if I so desire), or to be able to drag & drop a .pro file onto the scope icon to start & load.

kylie · Post by **kylie** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:57 am

Mr Arkadin wrote: Why not Firewire and eSATA - eSATA is twice as fast as Firewire800 - the more connectors the better.

SATA and its external brother eSATA are primarily for communication of the motherboard with storage devices like disk drives and optical mass storage. I don't know if there is room for other protocols above the physical layer, but there is no onboard or pci(e) controller based port that would allow other peripherals than storage devices at the moment.

-greetings, markus-

ps. ieee1394 would be nice for going mobile...

Brazda lui Novac · Post by **Brazda lui Novac** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:09 am

Counterparts wrote:How can you do that?

e.g. I save "myproject.pro", how can I get scope to start-up and load that project?

I'd either like a choice (or configure scope to give me a choice if I so desire), or to be able to drag & drop a .pro file onto the scope icon to start & load.

Yes you can. I don't have a scope here but I can tell you that somewhere in settings you have an option "save project as default" . Click on that after you have loaded your desired project, and next time scope will load with your project.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:13 am

Brazda lui Novac wrote: Yes you can. I don't have a scope here but I can tell you that somewhere in settings you have an option "save project as default" . Click on that after you have loaded your desired project, and next time scope will load with your project.

Yes, but I *think* that actually saves the project as 'default.pro' or something...(I'll check this evening to make sure!) I'd prefer to be able to load my 'default' project if I'm starting afresh or my current project (whatever that may be) if I wish to carry on where I left off

dawman · Post by **dawman** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:17 am

I Like counterparts' RAM idea also, maybe I could get rid of my Lexicon hardware then.

Look under settings, and save project as start-up,....Warning: I would advise loading the start-up w/ half of the polyphony. Once loaded, then max that cock sucker out. This will elimainate pop up windows 4 optomising during a gig. Trust me.

alfonso · Post by **alfonso** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:24 am

First of all all the best to the new company, that's really great news, I love the fact that the original idea under the scope adventure is still present to determine its future.

Regarding the idea to start with any project it would be nice, just clicking on a certain project and thus opening it, without the predetermination of saving it as default. What i can suggest, a.f.a. it isn't possible to have that object link way right now, is to save as default a totally empty project that will load very fast and then select your project, like it was just a browser like a Windows explorer, with the benefit of the file browser that could be have been left in a convenient setting in the last session.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:35 am

Yeah, that's a good idea (using a completely empty project). Bit like my head at times

Post by **hubird** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:46 am

I have a perfectly customized project that loads after i power on my OS9 mac

I admit I always forget about default and startup, but once done it's great

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:28 am

husker wrote: I can't understand why you guys keep going on about this... if you had OSX Intel drivers, what hardware would you run the drivers on exactly?????

Yeah, I fogot about the PCi/PCI-E thing...

I think both PCI-E and FireWire is necessary for a new Scope Platform, so we could use Scope with our laptops live. Of course there'd have to be plenty of memory on board to make it work, but I don't know if old devices would be compatible then. We'll have to wait and see what the geniuses at InDSP come up with...

Shayne

hifiboom · Post by **hifiboom** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 1:56 pm

garyb wrote:yes, please. PCIe not firewire.

PCI Express, yess

much more powerful than firewire.... and scalable with the lanes...

craighuddy · Post by **craighuddy** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:08 pm

Well,
we need PCIe first coupled with OSX/ Vista drivers to even have a prayer of getting new users. I hope these are in the plans.

CH

ScofieldKid · Post by **ScofieldKid** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:38 pm

Frank, thanks for all the great years working on Creamware!

Holger and Juergen, congratulations, and thanks for continuing the support of this elegant platform. Continued success!

I can hardly wait for Musicmesse.

valis · Post by **valis** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:39 pm

I see a lot of agreement about PCIe here, but I suspect that the ones at the top (so to speak) will interpret the market success of usb2 & firewire devices as a sign that it's a good marketable direction to head. So...we should list some of the reasons why we think we'd prefer PCIe (technical and otherwise).

Personally, from using both proprietary firewire based protocols hooked to a PCI/PCIe card (RME, Scope, MOTU etc ALL use firewire chipsets in a proprietary way in some of their products) and comparing this to similar devices implemented on Firewire (compared my Multiface to the fireface400 for instance) the slot based solution seems to achieve better latency figures, higher stability and less overhead for the system overall (assuming proper engineering).

In fact the new PCIe based RME stuff seems poised to allow some rather insane i/o counts when paired with MADI or other high i/o connector types. When I think of that number of datastreams going at once it really makes me wonder if resynthesis on the fly & various granular/timestretching stuff couldn't be pushed much farther on a new Scope platform (ie, since STS5000 already implements it to a certain degree).

With PCIe 4 cards in a system is feasable without bus contention.

With PCIe you don't have to worry about having limited external storage or having to add in a PCIe/PCI based firewire solution just because your bandwidth is gone.

Oh, and some onboard ram like the original DP toolkit does seem like it would be ideal, especially since I can't imagine that the cards would require anything expensive.

Post by **garyb** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:44 pm

exactly. the first point is the best. stability!
another one mentioned, price. a firewire box will be much more expensive....

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:20 pm

I say mend the software first.