Why is Jazz hated so much here?
Shroomz, yep Gilles plays some great stuff... his show is one of the few outlets for this kind of music (Benji B on BBC 1Xtra is good as well, although I haven't tuned in for a while). I once sold Gilles a mic when I was working in a music shop, it was a birthday gift for one of the MC's at his club, he's an all round top geezer really
Amazing coincidence !!!
The other night was the first time I'd listened to Giles Peterson's radio 1 DJ set for a long time, but I was so impressed that I'm gonna start tuning in again whenever possible. It's just a shame his slot's not a bit earlier. Even 12-2am would be a lot better for getting up at 8 am.
The other night was the first time I'd listened to Giles Peterson's radio 1 DJ set for a long time, but I was so impressed that I'm gonna start tuning in again whenever possible. It's just a shame his slot's not a bit earlier. Even 12-2am would be a lot better for getting up at 8 am.
were just having a chat around the topic with darkrezin and on that occasion i dug out a video of one of my favourite bands on youtube.com
Dunno if it's related but we both enjoyed it
Dunno if it's related but we both enjoyed it
just because you cannot imagine something that doesn't exclude it from reality.
I love Jazz - give it to me hard core style, real deal kind, smooth or the plain rediculously elevatorishly easy muzak kind. Dosnt matter, there is always someting in every musical style to be explored. Maybe even intelectually and/or emotionally understood - if your lucky....requires something called an "open mind".
Of course crap is crap, and you dont have to listen to the old 'Hi-Fi test tapes' saturday night because the music excites you, but if you can dig the silky/plastic productions for the sake of it being plastic well...another musical flavour available for your own 'cooking'.
If you dont agree - well thats ok to
Being a piss broke musician in London some years ago, I only occational had a spare £20 note to my disposal and one of my luxuries was to go album hunting in second hand stores, picking out albums becouse of covers, paying max 50p and going home diving into alot of bad- bad bad albums!!! But on almost every album there was one song being interesting in one way or another, sometimes you found gems - in anycase you have a lot of potential samplest.. Anybody heard of 'Misty In Roots - Live at the countereurovison 79'? Cost me 50p and my favourite Reggea album of all times.
Try it!
Oh by the way...from Metal I came...
Endre70
Of course crap is crap, and you dont have to listen to the old 'Hi-Fi test tapes' saturday night because the music excites you, but if you can dig the silky/plastic productions for the sake of it being plastic well...another musical flavour available for your own 'cooking'.
If you dont agree - well thats ok to
Being a piss broke musician in London some years ago, I only occational had a spare £20 note to my disposal and one of my luxuries was to go album hunting in second hand stores, picking out albums becouse of covers, paying max 50p and going home diving into alot of bad- bad bad albums!!! But on almost every album there was one song being interesting in one way or another, sometimes you found gems - in anycase you have a lot of potential samplest.. Anybody heard of 'Misty In Roots - Live at the countereurovison 79'? Cost me 50p and my favourite Reggea album of all times.
Try it!
Oh by the way...from Metal I came...
Endre70
If you havent had Pulsar hardware problems, then you really don't know what pain is..........
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pseudojazzer
- Posts: 222
- Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:00 pm
- Location: london
I've tried to stay out of this debate, cos with a name like mine people might get the impression that i might take sides 
First - sounds like i should check out Misty In Roots.. cheers for the tip.
Well - i love jazz, most kinds, not that elevator crap but the good stuff (eg most of blue note) I'm not gonna get into what i like or dislike specifically, cos that would last an age - and its a matter of opinion, so whilst my opinion may be informed is is not better of worse than anyone elses - and certainly holds no truth!
However, there are some universal reasons why i think that jazz is a valuable art, even for those who dont like it.......yet!
For producers it is valuable because some of the early recordings are the first experiments in stereo, and the reproduction of the sound, to my ears, is often superior to much of the stuff i hear today, its harsh and real, and i like that. As for the modern recordings, well i realy want to get hold of the wynton marsalis live at abbey road that was on at the weekend (if it ever gets released). There are no production tricks - just pure consumate musicianship, recorded well through high end gear, and this is just a joy to me - the sheer amount of nuance that one man can get through a trumpet is staggering, and at this end of the scale its a pleasure to listen to the acoustics so well captured, something that is not present in "pure" electronic music, and should be interesting just for this fact, even if you dont like the content of the tunes themselves.
For musicians, where to start? the influence of jazz pervades most of modern music, dance, pop, electronica, hip hop, etc.. Miles Davis' last album was arguably the first hiphop jazz crossover album personally i think its one of his worst outings but thats not the point - he was a true visionary - he saw where music was heading IMHO.
The reason why i think jazz is improtant is that there is much history behind it, too much to go into here, but musically it has shaped many styles - drum and bass would not exist in the way we know and love it if people hadn't sampled the winstons or other drum breaks from "rare groove" records. And thats just the beat!
I respect jazz and its harmonic/melodic constructs, many of which are over my head, and that is exactly why i respect it. I think that anyone who plays an instrument should try and play a few jazz "standards" as it is great to learn these tools, and listening to the greats gives great insight into melodic constructs.
At he end of all this rant i would like to say that the reason why i call myself "pseudo" is that i am certainly not a great jazz player, but it is something that i would like to be better at. It is just one of the many branches of music, no more valid than any other. If you choose not to listen to it that doesnt bother me a jot, many people say they dont like jazz quite rightfully, but to say "hate" without really knowing anything about the style - that does bother me. I personally think that someone who calls themselves a musician should be open to musical ideas, and both jazz and classical styles are overflowing with these, again this doesnt make them better than other styles, but IMHO there is much of interest aurally and technically when listening to beethoven, coltrane, armstrong, or whoever. To hate that might be a little careless.. but hey its all a matter of opinion
Cheers,
Tom
First - sounds like i should check out Misty In Roots.. cheers for the tip.
Well - i love jazz, most kinds, not that elevator crap but the good stuff (eg most of blue note) I'm not gonna get into what i like or dislike specifically, cos that would last an age - and its a matter of opinion, so whilst my opinion may be informed is is not better of worse than anyone elses - and certainly holds no truth!
However, there are some universal reasons why i think that jazz is a valuable art, even for those who dont like it.......yet!
For producers it is valuable because some of the early recordings are the first experiments in stereo, and the reproduction of the sound, to my ears, is often superior to much of the stuff i hear today, its harsh and real, and i like that. As for the modern recordings, well i realy want to get hold of the wynton marsalis live at abbey road that was on at the weekend (if it ever gets released). There are no production tricks - just pure consumate musicianship, recorded well through high end gear, and this is just a joy to me - the sheer amount of nuance that one man can get through a trumpet is staggering, and at this end of the scale its a pleasure to listen to the acoustics so well captured, something that is not present in "pure" electronic music, and should be interesting just for this fact, even if you dont like the content of the tunes themselves.
For musicians, where to start? the influence of jazz pervades most of modern music, dance, pop, electronica, hip hop, etc.. Miles Davis' last album was arguably the first hiphop jazz crossover album personally i think its one of his worst outings but thats not the point - he was a true visionary - he saw where music was heading IMHO.
The reason why i think jazz is improtant is that there is much history behind it, too much to go into here, but musically it has shaped many styles - drum and bass would not exist in the way we know and love it if people hadn't sampled the winstons or other drum breaks from "rare groove" records. And thats just the beat!
I respect jazz and its harmonic/melodic constructs, many of which are over my head, and that is exactly why i respect it. I think that anyone who plays an instrument should try and play a few jazz "standards" as it is great to learn these tools, and listening to the greats gives great insight into melodic constructs.
At he end of all this rant i would like to say that the reason why i call myself "pseudo" is that i am certainly not a great jazz player, but it is something that i would like to be better at. It is just one of the many branches of music, no more valid than any other. If you choose not to listen to it that doesnt bother me a jot, many people say they dont like jazz quite rightfully, but to say "hate" without really knowing anything about the style - that does bother me. I personally think that someone who calls themselves a musician should be open to musical ideas, and both jazz and classical styles are overflowing with these, again this doesnt make them better than other styles, but IMHO there is much of interest aurally and technically when listening to beethoven, coltrane, armstrong, or whoever. To hate that might be a little careless.. but hey its all a matter of opinion
Cheers,
Tom
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Nestor
- Posts: 6683
- Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Fourth Dimension Paradise, Cloud Nine!
Hey Pseudojazzer, what a nice and coherent post, real cool points there...
I would like to add some more to it: When you follow any particular kind of music, in most cases, the stylistic spectrums of variations that have been born from the main source have an end after about the 30 variations. You will find that this is what happens with Rock music, which has about 30 most important variations, the more widespread and heard in the world.
Classical music in its own right has one of the richest structures, varieties and styles.
Now, when it comes to Jazz music, wow! The amount of well known and resourceful styles is amazing...
I would like to add some more to it: When you follow any particular kind of music, in most cases, the stylistic spectrums of variations that have been born from the main source have an end after about the 30 variations. You will find that this is what happens with Rock music, which has about 30 most important variations, the more widespread and heard in the world.
Classical music in its own right has one of the richest structures, varieties and styles.
Now, when it comes to Jazz music, wow! The amount of well known and resourceful styles is amazing...
*MUSIC* The most Powerful Language in the world! *INDEED*
Interesting that so many posts can be found in this thread... I wouldn't have expected this...
For me, Jazz is essential. As a teenager, I was much into fusion or Jazz-Rock like Chick Corea or Weather Report. Some time later, I found this kind of music (not all) uninspired. So I was looking for something new and exciting. Then I discovered the so-called "New York Downtown" scene (Knitting Factory, John Zorn, Fred Frith, Bill Frisell etc.) and found it really great. Although much of this stuff can't be called Jazz (in the traditional sense), it has broadened my interests, because this music itself draws its influences from many sources.
Today I enjoy the diversity of music created by these musicians.
For me, Jazz is essential. As a teenager, I was much into fusion or Jazz-Rock like Chick Corea or Weather Report. Some time later, I found this kind of music (not all) uninspired. So I was looking for something new and exciting. Then I discovered the so-called "New York Downtown" scene (Knitting Factory, John Zorn, Fred Frith, Bill Frisell etc.) and found it really great. Although much of this stuff can't be called Jazz (in the traditional sense), it has broadened my interests, because this music itself draws its influences from many sources.
Today I enjoy the diversity of music created by these musicians.
Is Harold Mayburn, or JD Parran, Julius Hemphill still playing the village? They are really scary, and traditional.
When I want to pass out and go to sleep, I find that there is a good use 4 the " smooth jazz ". It makes Kenny G. look so up tempo.
Gimme' Miles, Weather Report, Yellow Jackets, and old Mahavishnu Orchestra.
When I want to pass out and go to sleep, I find that there is a good use 4 the " smooth jazz ". It makes Kenny G. look so up tempo.
Gimme' Miles, Weather Report, Yellow Jackets, and old Mahavishnu Orchestra.
Julius Hemphill died several years ago, JD Parran is still active. Harold Mayburn? Don't know him, have to check him out. I think what you are referring to, Jimmy, is the loft scene of the 70ies. There are a lot of people like Anthony Braxton or David Murrary who now play with younger musicians from the next generation(s).Is Harold Mayburn, or JD Parran, Julius Hemphill still playing the village? They are really scary, and traditional.