OSX and Linux status update

symbiote · Post by **symbiote** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 3:41 pm

Awesome!

Post by **hubird** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:17 pm

yeah, it reads quite different if you don't know that

phyx · Post by **phyx** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 6:30 pm

On 2005-08-23 05:00, gustav wrote:
Phyx : good luck - I hope it could work so tell us when you did some testing

Btw : Its amazing how emotional is the reaction of all this people here.

Thanks, ... What I am doing isn't that hard, it's just time consuming because I need to learn more about hardware programming... I only know the basics of C, php, and perl

---

Yes, most noobs are very emotional online. It's the disembodied effect that impersonal communication has. ... or a lack of nature's subjective reality and an overdose of the Modern World's objective reality.

phyx · Post by **phyx** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 6:39 pm

On 2005-08-23 16:24, hubird wrote:
a bottle of Wine on the table?
if I only know what Wine is...

http://www.winehq.org

W.I.N.E = "Wine Is Not an Emulator"

[ This Message was edited by: phyx on 2005-08-23 19:39 ]

phyx · Post by **phyx** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 6:45 pm

On 2005-08-23 09:01, astroman wrote:
this is pure nonsense - because if it would be true then Wine would outperform VMWare in that context (and everyone buying the latter be an idiot who throw his cash out of the window)

Wine does out perform VMWare.

Wine is not an emulator. Windows programs run no faster nor slower then they would natively on windows.

Nuendo 3.0 runs great on Wine, so does Wavelab 5.... I havn't gotten VSTi to work yet... but that isn't a loss.

Even Rome: Total War runs perfectly, and thats a fairly hefty directX game.

Post by **garyb** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:44 pm

and still no music made.....

blazesboylan · Post by **blazesboylan** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 10:25 pm

Not true. This thread *is* music.

But it's encrypted, so you need some WINE to find it melodious!

hands the banjo to garyb and the harmonica to hubird and starts singing "oh my Linux left me for another OS, my Mac done got sunk in a pool of cess, oh yodel-odel-odel-oh I'm so lonesome I could lay my head down and reboot the kernel and die..."

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:24 am

On 2005-08-23 22:44, garyb wrote:
and still no music made.....

maybe - but if the sh*t really works, I got a pretty cool solution for my developement system that even spares me a machine and a Win2k license...

cheers, Tom

Post by **garyb** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:41 am

i.m no programmer, but quotes like "But for those applications that do work and from a purely subjective point of view, performance is good. There is no obvious performance loss, except for some slow graphics due to unoptimized Wine code and X11 driver translation performance loss (which can be a problem sometimes, though)." and "Now to be frank, performance is not yet a Wine priority", from the wine faq, i'd almost bet money it won't work. period.

phyx · Post by **phyx** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:13 am

On 2005-08-24 01:41, garyb wrote:
i.m no programmer, but quotes like "But for those applications that do work and from a purely subjective point of view, performance is good. There is no obvious performance loss, except for some slow graphics due to unoptimized Wine code and X11 driver translation performance loss (which can be a problem sometimes, though)." and "Now to be frank, performance is not yet a Wine priority", from the wine faq, i'd almost bet money it won't work. period.

Where are you reading that? sounds outdated...

read this http://www.winehq.org/site/myths

...and I know from personal experience. Wine is as buggy as windows. so what does it matter?

...but, I have enver lost an album running Wine.. I have running windows.

...and another point. I am doing this for myself, no one else.

Recording a sound is the smallest part of making my music, my art is created by the food i eat, the books i read, the dishes i wash, the operating system i run, all the way to the very elite and specialized audience i do this all for.

The artist is the art, hacking these drivers is my music.

http://www.myspace.com/northernsector

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:16 am

On 2005-08-24 01:41, garyb wrote:
... and "Now to be frank, performance is not yet a Wine priority", from the wine faq, i'd almost bet money it won't work. period.

same here - and why wouldn't Willi have tried it long ago if there was at least a tiny chance ?

scope runs on linux under wine would have been quite an announcement

my 'if it works...' refers to nothing but the programming language for database stuff, which is a rather straight forward thing - no bells or whistles.

cheers, Tom

[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2005-08-24 02:19 ]

Post by **garyb** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:43 am

On 2005-08-24 02:13, phyx wrote:
Where are you reading that? sounds outdated...

read this http://www.winehq.org/site/myths

that's exactly where i read that!

i'm not impressed by any type of elitist.

symbiote · Post by **symbiote** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:59 am

Well, that's ok, I'm not impressed by non-programmers with no familiarity with BSD making claims such as "It won't work."

Also, did "Wili" try to write a kernel driver? Cuz it's can't really be voodoo, the SFP software and card have to talk to each other somehow thru the PCI bus. No need to encrypt or decrypt anything.

As someone who used to successfully run a BBS in PCBoard in Desqview (cheap DOS multitasking application) in DOSemu in Linux Slackware 1.1.0 in like 1995 on a 486dx, I find this pessimism pretty funny.

John Cooper · Post by **John Cooper** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:38 am

Just a minor note, to throw into this evolving melody:

I believe Muse Receptor uses Wine on Linux to run a bunch of Windows VST plugin binaries under their own VST host...

-John

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:44 am

I think Frank mentioned that the profit is in the radio software. They don't care about us anymore. I'm not expecting any updates ever from creamware.

On 2004-12-30 20:24, hubird wrote:
I guess Creamware is the last company in the world that has a mac compatible soundcard with no OSX support.
We reach the point that it gets rediculous for Creamware Audio to announce OSX support after all...

I've not seen many signs that say it's on Creamware's priority list.
Willie and friends seem to be surprised about the devellopments.
Now that they are getting close to a Linux beta version Creamware realizes the consequences.
I even wouldn't call that fair.

I don't want to discuss the rationality of that source code decision, it's really up to CreamwareAudio, but I guess there's a lot of work done by some Linux programmers, and everybody was aware of that.
I'd say some coordination would have been proper then .

I don't know what's happening behind Creamware's doors of course, but with the information we have this is the impression I get.
I really hope Creamware will soon find the company or programmers it needs for doing OSX, and also find a way to work together with the Linux boys, to take profit from their good job.

Moreover, there's also the hardware side of the story, the card's voltage problem,
so it's rather heavy at the moment, also from Creamware's view point, I understand that.
But some day I have to step over to a G5, preferrably somewhere in 2005!
Besides, what a pleasure it will be to use my Phatmatic Pro in the greatly updated OSX version, or to buy the Lounge Wizzard...

I think the new products recently were a smart move, as they are new mony makers and the knowledge and all was already there, but now every delay concerning OSZ/Linux is wrong, for us and for CreamwareAudio itself, Willie said that already

It's guessing at the moment how important OSX/Linux is for CreamwareAudio.
Some official announcement, some vague timeline now would be very appreciated, to keep the flame and our trust burning.
Is there anything you could tell us, mr. Frank Hund?
It would be much appreciated
cheers

[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2004-12-30 20:27 ]

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:31 pm

On 2005-08-24 12:44, braincell wrote:
I think Frank mentioned that the profit is in the radio software. They don't care about us anymore. ...

in fact Braincell, there is evidence that you're pretty close to the truth... though the last sentence reads a bit too fatalistic.

imho they won't completely 'sacrifice' that part of their userbase, but talking strictly business the focus has (to be) moved

cheers, Tom

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:48 pm

On 2005-08-24 07:59, symbiote wrote:
...Also, did "Wili" try to write a kernel driver? Cuz it's can't really be voodoo, the SFP software and card have to talk to each other somehow thru the PCI bus. No need to encrypt or decrypt anything...

well, first my apologies for emphasizing that encrypt/decrypt thing.
I really did mention this ONLY to point out that a certain part of the card's operation will not be documented by CWA.
It is of course NOT at all related to write communications software or similiar stuff.

'kernel level programming' was mentioned by Willi in the beginning of the project in context with Mac programmers.
Someone with kernel level programming skills under OSXwas desperately needed and obviously not found.
Since the Linux and OSX part were planned in a synergic way I guess it applies to both OSes.

cheers, Tom
ps my language supplier had no experience with their system under WINE, but no concerns either - I'll probably give BSD a shot on the weekend

btw the request was answered (including 2 forwarded emails) within 15 minutes.
that's what support is about - but they are not exactly cheapo either...

[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2005-08-24 13:54 ]

Post by **garyb** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:19 pm

symbiote,
if you think i'm saying "it won't work", you misunderstand me. i doubt if it will work and if i'm wrong that's fine!
elitism is still disgusting, sorry.

i would love to see linux and especially osx versions.

blazesboylan · Post by **blazesboylan** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:45 pm

On 2005-08-24 14:19, garyb wrote:
i would love to see osx and especially linux versions.

Post by **hubird** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:14 pm

yeah man.