## New MVC module with note off velocity

Scope and XITE Development

Original topic on PlanetZ: https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic.php?t=27419

#### New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 2:53 pm
by Shroomz~>
Hi all,
Here's a simple circuit sharc came up with to add Note Off (gate, Esync & velocity) to an MVC.

Attachments
  MVC with Note Off Vel.zip
    (13.05 KiB) Downloaded 150 times

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 3:14 pm
by Shroomz~>
Btw, for Cubase users - to edit the Note Off Velocity, open the List Editor & edit data value 3 for your note entries.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 5:34 pm
by dawman
Thanks Shroomz.
When someone tells you no, you just dig in your heels don't ya'?....

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 5:46 pm
by Shroomz~>
It wizny me this time Jimmy. Twas sharc who made it. I'm just the bearer of the good news.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 9:53 pm
by eric

> Shroomz~> wrote:It wizny me this time Jimmy. Twas sharc who made it. I'm just the bearer of the good news.

Thanks Mark and Sharc. (that has a kind of ring to it....)
BTW did you know there is a new MIDI message which extends the note on/off velocity resolution by 7 bits?
http://www.midi.org/techspecs/ca31.pdf
Eric.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 2:51 pm
by Shroomz~>
Yes, we knew about that & it's been mentioned here on Z several times. It's possible to implement it in Scope devices, but we don't have any hard or software here which supports it. There's definitely some useful applications for it in synthesis, but for most applications a velocity range which consists of 16,256 steps is over the top imo. How long have we had the 14-bit control change & NRPN standards? Despite the fact that many hardware midi controller manufacturers have given us support for the 14-bit standards, they don't all actually give you full control of the 14-bit resolution & even taking into account that some controllers actually DO, we're still not seeing enough widespread adoption of the standards by hardware & software manufacturers.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 3:00 pm
by Neutron
maybe it could be used in the axon guitar to midi controller, they might even put it in in an update (they are updating it a lot with user suggestions) then you could tell if a note was muted or decayed naturally and the controlled synth could be set to have a different release according to release velocity.
its quite annoying either having to have notes which cut off at a predetermined level, or putting a long release to reduce that effect, but then the release is also there when you mute.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:49 pm
by Shroomz~>

> Neutron wrote:its quite annoying either having to have notes which cut off at a predetermined level, or putting a long release to reduce that effect, but then the release is also there when you mute.

Are you talking about the guitar to midi controller?

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 4:53 pm
by Neutron
yes its a terratec axon 100. its quite good, much faster resoponse than the roland because it uses a different way to detect notes.
But when you sustain a long note, the synth will cut off suddenly as the amplitude of the guitar gets down to a certain level.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:27 pm
by eric

> Shroomz~> wrote:Yes, we knew about that & it's been mentioned here on Z several times. It's possible to implement it in Scope devices, but we don't have any hard or software here which supports it. There's definitely some useful applications for it in synthesis, but for most applications a velocity range which consists of 16,256 steps is over the top imo. How long have we had the 14-bit control change & NRPN standards? Despite the fact that many hardware midi controller manufacturers have given us support for the 14-bit standards, they don't all actually give you full control of the 14-bit resolution & even taking into account that some controllers actually DO, we're still not seeing enough widespread adoption of the standards by hardware & software manufacturers.

I agree completely. But we must try and set or maintain a standard here too as "manufacturers". How hard would it be for developers, shareware and 3rd Party, to implement the things I've been highlighting recently into current plugs/products? (serious question). John Bowen stepped up to the plate instantly on the PAT issue, and has done a demo version of Pro-Wave for me to try out. If there is more support for these then perhaps the manufacturers of controllers will start to respond. A direct approach may be the way to go.
IMHO there is a lot of potential with ever increasing CPU and DSP power to get some more control of our instruments using already established protocols i.e. MIDI.
Some people reading these threads can see applications for PAT and Note-off velocity that they were unaware of before.
Eric.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 1:00 pm
by Shroomz~>

> eric wrote:How hard would it be for developers, shareware and 3rd Party, to implement the things I've been highlighting recently into current plugs/products? (serious question).

In the case of the note off velocity, it shouldn't be too difficult in most cases & I definitely agree that it's potentially a very useful modulation source, in synthesis particularly. We already had the possibility to use note off gate signals for triggering purposes, as I explained to you before. Now we can use Note-off velocity too & yes, perhaps there is good reason to support the extended velocity resolution, but without a suitable controller to test it here, it's very difficult.

> eric wrote:If there is more support for these then perhaps the manufacturers of controllers will start to respond. A direct approach may be the way to go.
> Some people reading these threads can see applications for PAT and Note-off velocity that they were unaware of before.

Lets see if people take it on board. Sharc & I will certainly include Note-off velocity in our synthesis projects, possibly PAT as well, although we don't have a PAT capable keyboard, which again makes it difficult.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 8:48 pm
by eric

> Shroomz~> wrote: Lets see if people take it on board. Sharc & I will certainly include Note-off velocity in our synthesis projects, possibly PAT as well, although we don't have a PAT capable keyboard, which again makes it difficult.

All noted, thanks.
Just for testing functionality you could edit a sequencer file. I will make you a MIDI file if you like which generates PAT for every note, for testing.
Eric.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 8:57 pm
by Shroomz~>
I'm pretty sure we can generate the PAT in cubase actually, but I'll let you know if we need that midi file.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Wed May 27, 2009 5:53 am
by eric

> Shroomz~> wrote:Hi all,
> Here's a simple circuit sharc came up with to add Note Off (gate, Esync & velocity) to an MVC.

Just went to try it and it says i'm missing a dsp file Gate Inverter Poly.
Do you have this file please?
Eric.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Wed May 27, 2009 7:20 am
by Shroomz~>

GateInverterPoly.zip
  (3.21 KiB) Downloaded 124 times

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Wed May 27, 2009 10:02 pm
by eric
Ta!

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:56 pm
by eric
Now it's asking for - Midi Voice control 16 UD
Do you have this please? Maybe any other DSP files you think it needs please.
Eric.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 6:18 am
by Shroomz~>
Between your SDK & Scope dsp folders, you should have these dsp files. All you should have to do is check which files each dsp folder contains that the other is missing & copy the relevant files either way. If for some reason you don't have the files at all, then I'll put all the required files in a pack. You should really have them though.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 7:12 pm
by eric

> Shroomz~> wrote:Between your SDK & Scope dsp folders, you should have these dsp files. All you should have to do is check which files each dsp folder contains that the other is missing & copy the relevant files either way. If for some reason you don't have the files at all, then I'll put all the required files in a pack. You should really have them though.

Mark,
My 2nd SDK (the first one never arrived) is still winging it's way from Germany to Australia!
I could wait but would like to try out the MVC in Modular.
I searched all my disks, including CD's and can't find it.
Thanks,
Eric.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2009 6:57 am
by Shroomz~>
Hi Eric,
This a circuit module for using in the sdk. It won't work properly in the modular because it's not in the format for modular modules.

#### Re: New MVC module with note off velocity

Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 12:05 am
by eric
OK Mark, thanks.
I'll just have to wait - again.
Is anyone going to make a modular module from it? Or is that my first task with SDK?
Eric.