## That good old RB-338

Device/Module Wishlist

Original topic on PlanetZ: https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic.php?t=19766

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Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:12 am
by pollux
This is my personal litlle utopia..
ReBirth is one of my fetish pieces of software, and dreamt to have it on SFP since I got my powerPulsar
Since it has been released by propellerheads as free (as in beer) software, I ask myself it if woudl be of any harm to them if a "DSP powered clone" appeared on the nature... it has a sooooooo simple UI that even a nerd like me could make use of it...
I'm a totally noob (ultra totally noob) with SDK, but I saw that every component of the RB-338 has alrady been done (TB-303+pattern sequencer, 800 and 909, delay...); so I believe it would be possible to model it.
thoughts?
R.

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Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:18 am
by sharc
Yes I think it would be possible, but even as a free device, it may attract the attention of Roland's lawyers. I think this is probably the reason for Propellerheads making Rebirth a freebie. Would be cool tho.

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Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:31 am
by sharc
...Then again, I suppose if the GUI was different enough in terms of style and layout and any samples used for the drum machines were taken from clones rather than an actual 808/909, then I don't see that there would be a problem

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Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 9:21 pm
by hifiboom
jeah, but on the other hand, who would want a sample based 909 or 808...?
We already have that multid drum sample players for CW.

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Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 9:50 am
by sharc
Agreed, but using samples on some of the sounds would free up dsp resources (especially for the drums that are only samples in the first place on the 909). As long as the tone controls, etc are properly emulated it shouldn't make a noticable difference to a lot of the sounds. For instance Fahrenheit on the Chameleon uses samples and yet it performs well against the best of 808 & 909 clones (Drumstation, Jomox etc). AFAIK Rebirth uses samples also.

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Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 2:15 pm
by hifiboom

> On 2006-08-23 10:50, sharc wrote:
> Agreed, but using samples on some of the sounds would free up dsp resources (especially for the drums that are only samples in the first place on the 909). As long as the tone controls, etc are properly emulated it shouldn't make a noticable difference to a lot of the sounds. For instance Fahrenheit on the Chameleon uses samples and yet it performs well against the best of 808 & 909 clones (Drumstation, Jomox etc). AFAIK Rebirth uses samples also.

of course sound-wise samples are as good as analog generated srums ounds, but you loose the modulation from free oscillators...
Every Clap on a real 909 sounds slightly other than the next one....
and yes I d also like to see some modeled 808, 909 and 303

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Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:01 am
by Shroomz~>

> On 2006-08-23 15:15, hifiboom wrote:
> of course sound-wise samples are as good as analog generated drum sounds, but you loose the modulation from free oscillators...

Not necessarily if you convert drum samples to wavetables which is how some of the existing 808 & 909 'clones' are implemented as far as I know.

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Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:44 am
by tgstgs
if one of the programmers need referenc for cloning i own a 808 in perfect contition
good vibes from vienna

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Posted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:17 am
by Shroomz~>
*Actual* 8o8 & 9o9 samples might be ok if it's a free device, but Rol*nd's lawyers would be onto anything commercial (for sale) in a flash which uses actual samples of the originals. For a purely sample based device a 'clone' (drumstation or fahrenheit) would need to be 'unofficially' sampled. Again, with a 'modelled' device there shouldn't be a problem (AFAIK) if it's free, but commercial devices would be at risk of breaking copyright & or patent laws if I'm not mistaken.

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Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 9:34 am
by Joat

> hifiboom wrote:

> > Every Clap on a real 909 sounds slightly other than the next one....

I just had to.. Clap in TR-909 is a sample. There are analog controls for it, but the sound is a sample. Roland TR-909 is a hybrid machine. Hihats. claps, crash, ride and some other sounds are samples, Bass drum, toms and some others are synthesized.
Every clap in actual TR-909 does not sound a little different in a way every bass drum does. It sounds slightly different in a way a sampled instrument played through envelope generator and eq / filter would. No phase alteration, no drifting of the oscillators, none of that.
And that is "slightly" in a way us mortals can't tell. Really.
Still, TR-909 is agreat drum machine. And RB 338 does a good job emulating it. And if you have ever used "skins" for rb 338 you know a lot of them had replacement drumsounds for "909" included.
Edit: I forgot to add the original reason I strated to write this message:
Propellerheads had Roland's permission to sell ReBirth and use Roland's machine's names and sounds. It was not discontinued because of legal issues.
Propellerheads stated the time has past ReBirth. And they are right.
If it was for legal reasons, do you honestly think Roland would allow them to give it away for free as they do now?
Don't take my word for it, download it yourself:
http://www.rebirthmuseum.com/
For free, no questions asked. No Roland lawyers banging your door. =)

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Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:42 pm
by maky325

> Joat wrote:
> I just had to.. Clap in TR-909 is a sample. There are analog controls for it, but the sound is a sample.

No it is not! The sound can be viewed as the result of lots of people clapping nearly all at once, and is actually produced on the TR909 by passing white noise through a band-pass filter. Two envelopes are used on a VCA; one is a repeating sawtooth-shaped envelope, to produce the 'lots of people clapping nearly all at once' sound, while the other envelope has a long decay to produce the reverb. This sharp, hollow sound is another that the Roland boxes make in a way that simply nothing else does
I just had to...

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Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 3:09 am
by maky325
And yes hifiboom is saying right, every Clap on a real 909 sounds slightly other than the next one as in 808

#### Re: That good old RB-338

Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 4:10 pm
by fmpsycho
use the real RB-338 the pulsar isn't that Sound at all ....
you want a good Tb303 Get Orbiton 303 Recommended