## Midi parameter smoothing device..

Device/Module Wishlist

Original topic on PlanetZ: https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic.php?t=25011

#### Midi parameter smoothing device..

Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:15 pm
by maky325
I dont know is this possible to do but i will try to explain. Just as user in this thread: https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic ... ght=filter copy/paste: tweaking filter and stuff from the midicontroller gives stepping. When i controll it with the mouse its okay. Same can be said for controlling/tweaking filter from host. You have resolution of 127 steps. So basically i am asking can someone create device which will do that? Smoothing or if you want to say interpolating between those 127 steps so we can have smooth control movement.. AFAIK there is something possible to do in combination with Modular III and his internal Constant value and envelope follower already and there is even thread about it but i cant find it now. Also there is something similar bundled with Flexor. It is named "Control Smoother" but there are a lot of us without Flexor license.
Of course by modular nature of scope this could be used not just for smooth filter sweeps but for anything you like. If possible device should be connected in block like "Sequencer Midi Source Out --- Midi Parameter Smoother --- MINIMAX Midi in(or device by choice)" . Device could have just one knob controlling percent of smoothing. My english is still bad so hopefully someone will understand my points. Now I will also post some pictures now just for better explanation:
I can contribute in giving this simple GUI so developer can focus on doing that device(Photoshop native format but i can export in whatever you want).
So with smoothing knob we could make something from this:
In to something like this:
Or even this:
In case someone is wondering this is FL Studio automation lane but is is internal only and can be used for VST internal automation only. It does not have any effect in scope.This is just for better explanation of working system.

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 6:15 am
by Lima
To do what's you're talking about, a developer should have access to the internal circuits of the synth. In this way it "should" be quite easy to put a low pass filter after the midi to cv conversion or to add an external VCF controller input. BUT most of the devices, like the Minimax, are protected and can't be modified in any way. Moreover there should be some legal issues when modding a commercial product.
So the only way IMHO should be asking to SonicCore about add such a feature and to the mighty developers to add a "voltage controller input" in their upcomming synths...

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 6:46 am
by maky325

> Lima wrote:To do what's you're talking about, a developer should have access to the internal circuits of the synth. In this way it "should" be quite easy to put a low pass filter after the midi to cv conversion or to add an external VCF controller input. BUT most of the devices, like the Minimax, are protected and can't be modified in any way. Moreover there should be some legal issues when modding a commercial product.
> So the only way IMHO should be asking to SonicCore about add such a feature and to the mighty developers to add a "voltage controller input" in their upcomming synths...

But this is already possible. Without accessing anything inside synth. You can do it with modular III. It goes like "seq midi out --Modular III midi in(with preconfigured midi patch),then midi out to --- yoursynthhere".
So basically that modular III patch wrapped in some GUI will do the trick. I am guessing but that will be probably enough...(there is thread about doing this but i cant find it)
http://adern.com/manuals/flexor/referen ... oother.htm
This module smooths out any control signal fed to it. It is ideal for smoothing steps from low-resolution midi controllers, or for the creation of glides between notes generated by note/control sequencer, and it can also round the edges of a square or saw shaped LFOs. This module is optimized for non audio-rate, control signals.
Max. Polyphony: 16
In:
This is the module’s input. Here you connect any control signal intended to be smoothed.
Smooth:
This control sets the amount of smoothing to be applied. Turning the knob towards the right will result in more smoothing of the signal.
mods:
These are inputs for control signals (usually from an Envelope, LFO or other oscillator) which are used to modulate the amount of smoothing applied to the incoming signal. The mod knobs adjust how much the Smooth function is modulated by the control signals, and are bipolar.
Out:
This is the audio output of this module, where the processed signal emerges.
Also check this:
https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic ... 316f5111f8

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:23 am
by FrancisHarmany
Do you know about SpaceF CC5 ?
http://www.spacef-devices.com/dacore/in ... 5&Itemid=1

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:08 pm
by Tau

> mpodrug wrote: But this is already possible. Without accessing anything inside synth. You can do it with modular III. It goes like "seq midi out --Modular III midi in(with preconfigured midi patch),then midi out to --- yoursynthhere".
> So basically that modular III patch wrapped in some GUI will do the trick. I am guessing but that will be probably enough...(there is thread about doing this but i cant find it)

But wouldn't the smoothed signal have to be converted back to MIDI after leaving the ModIII via MIDI output ports (and therefore be returned to its stepped nature)? If I understand correctly, the problem is with MIDI's 8-bit limitation to 128 steps, and you're trying to find a way to interpolate these steps into a finer resolution, which I guess can only be done inside modular or any other device. To interpolate the incoming MIDI and convert it to a higher resolution control signal (not MIDI) means it has to sit between the MIDI input and the module's modulation input.
CC5 and CC8 are excellent, but I believe the effect they have has more to do with smoothly generating the CC movements (avoiding large jumps) than actually generating values in-between steps (as that couldn't be transmitted as MIDI data) - I think...
To overcome this, I was experimenting with using audio signals as control sources: the idea was that the amplitude (volume) of a 24-bit audio stream would certainly provide a lot more resolution than 128 steps, if it could be interpreted as a control signal. I posted about this a while ago and had some truly ace responses - take a look here, as I couldn't say it better:
https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic.php?t=24256
Hope this helps!
Much peace,
T

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Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:27 am
by maky325
CC5 helped, Tau reply helped. Thanks guys

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Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 4:11 am
by dawman
Try Mehdi's Wax-S Wah-Wah Pedal.
His pictured virtual pedal moves as you move your actual pedal, and has the same technology applied to it. If you are using say a Yamaha FC7, or M-Audio expression pedal and don't like the play or looseness of it, just adjust the tension.
I have never had such control w/ MIDI CC's and uses, until I started using Scope DSP cards.
There really is no equal.
This comes from platform maturity, and quality developers with years of support and experience.
Now go fight the good fight and win !!