## Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Device/Module Wishlist

Original topic on PlanetZ: https://forums.scopeusers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33125

#### Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 6:43 pm
by dante
The Emerson Moog Modular (released at MoogFest earlier this year) :

  MoogFest Modular
  Moog-New-Emerson-Modular-System.jpg (106.93 KiB) Viewed 10415 times

Would this be possible (even if too hard) to do in M4? Development of the custom handcrafted unit took three years with designers using the original documentation as well as circuit board and art files for nearly every original Moog module.
I dont think anyone will do it, Im just interested on opinions on whether M4 would have all the required circuits and enough power on a single XITE-1.

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 12:05 am
by dante
Failing that, how about a new classic synth emulation for Scope 6 ?

  junow8
  junow8.jpg (126.83 KiB) Viewed 10394 times

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:41 am
by Bud Weiser

> dante wrote:The Emerson Moog Modular (released at MoogFest earlier this year) :
> Moog-New-Emerson-Modular-System.jpg
> Would this be possible (even if too hard) to do in M4? Development of the custom handcrafted unit took three years with designers using the original documentation as well as circuit board and art files for nearly every original Moog module.
> I dont think anyone will do it, Im just interested on opinions on whether M4 would have all the required circuits and enough power on a single XITE-1.

Hard to tell from that pic.
Did you investigate into all the modules used in Emerson´s modular synth ?
We´d need a list, than compare what´s available in Modular I / II / III / IV / CWM and BCM up to now.
I expect possibilities in SCOPE are far superior meanwhile and compared to the hardware MOOG modular synth.
The sound of MOOG is all about the ladder filter and envelope generator speed.
IIRC, someone (fra77x or Sharc ?) offered "vintage ADSR" for SCOPE modular some time ago.
Array of Stepsequencers won´t work in 64Bit SCOPE for the time being I fear.
Bud

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:43 am
by Bud Weiser

> dante wrote:Failing that, how about a new classic synth emulation for Scope 6 ?
> junow8.jpg

That´s not a JUNOW 8 ...
It´s a YOU PEE (EIGHT) ...
Bud

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 6:37 am
by SilverScoper
I'd take the JP8 any day. With the Emerson we sometimes found it hard to get the same sound twice for the same patch.

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 9:07 am
by jhulk
most of the scope modular series of modules are compatible there is a ladder filter
missing from scope but i have made it is the fixed filter bank
and most things can be made with bcmodular and the circuit module shells
in fact most modular modules from all designers have extra level circuit modules
they use summers which take several inputs and summ then to one level
then there are attenuators to change the level going into the module
then there are output modules with attenuators for output levels
some have inbuilt lfo and also cv mixers
we have all these circuit level modules and can create similar modules in the clm shells
thats how i did the polymoog resonator and the sem filter and the fixed filter bank and the 4/8 equinox phaser
and how i have just created the yamaha gx-1 tone board voice

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 9:25 am
by jhulk
this is a serge filter module mclass panel
you can do this easily in the clm shells
same for this panel

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:45 pm
by dante
Good stuff, so M4 can cover most or all of the ground covered by the $90,000 Moog Modular.

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 8:21 pm
by jksuperstar
...and then some.

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:06 am
by Bud Weiser

> dante wrote:Good stuff, so M4 can cover most or all of the ground covered by the $90,000 Moog Modular.

Hans Zimmer has a wall of Moog Modular in his studio and he said once,- SCOPE Modular beats all exisiting hardware modular synths out there.
That might be somewhat overrated because real analogue always sounds different compared to emulations and it´s a matter of taste too, but functionality wise, a great sounding total recall modular synth where you can easy swap modules, is a big advantage over the old patchchord beast w/ their fixed set of hardware modules,- and don´t forget how bulky they were.
Bud

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:32 am
by jhulk
it can do stuff the moog modular can only dream of
multisample osc
digital osc wavetable osc
waldorf wavetable scanning
moog only had 2 filters hipass ladder and lowpass ladder
then it had resonators
you have multi filters and can create any type filter you want by combining fllters
i have just made a extended version of the serge resonant eq
which has 10 fixed bands of bandpass filters that are 7th of octave frequency settings rather than the 3rd octave setting which give it notches
in places that normal eq dont have that are musical
it has 3 out puts 2 combs and all bands the resonant feature is also very interesting as its not done the same as usual as a negitive feedback added to the incoming signal
but each band has a pot and the wiper goes to the filter input and each end of the pot one goes to the input and the other goes side is from the summer before the final vca
so it mixes the input and out put and when you have it fully on resonant it does not self oscillate but has a nice resonant quality as its just the feed back input and not both the input and output
on my version though i have it with lowpass/bandpass/hipass/variable notch so my version has 12 audio outputs
you also have fm osc and additive osc
and drum osc
and by using several modules you can create quadrature osc these are great for phasers in a dual stereo as you can have several banks of series allpass filters
and for the right side you can use the 180 degrees phase while the 0 degree phase on the left channel
and by have a quadrature osc you get 8 lfo outputs at different phases and there 180 degree opposite phase outputs
this creates a lot of notch bands by having 4 sets of allpass 4 stage phasers and each has its own lfo modulator and there outputs are summed
and the opposite channel has the same but uses the 180 degree phases opposite lfo outputs you can get some great phaser effects
the same thing can also be created for pitch and frequency shifters
any modular module you can think of in hardware can be visualized with bc modular and clm modules
as all the building blocks are there that are available for hardware
and for visual if you want it to look the same the new scopesync and its xml gui implementation you can create the modules in the modular then skin a gui so it looks how you want it to look and control the modular modules

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:42 am
by jhulk
and if you look at that moog modular it has multiples of the same modules so it has banks of oscillators
banks of filters banks of lfo banks of envelope generators banks of cv mod circuits it has 2 fixed filter banks and 2 sequencer modules banks of vca and a couple of mixer modules with panning circuits
there are not that many single modules there at all
with scope 2/3/4 modular there are 300+ modules
then theirs the flexor 1/2/3 which has lots of modules
then theirs the spacef modular modules
the john bowen rd modules
bc modular modules 300+
then there are the sal modules
and roy thinnes modules
we have a massive amount of modules to choose from which would cost £1000000 if we brought the hardware equivelents
and by using the clm shell and combining modules to create complex modules you have even more scope for new modules

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:51 am
by jhulk
as for classic synth modules
im working on a few
the yamaha gx-1 which the cs80 was designed from
the sk20d which yayajohn is sampling for me from his synth that i repaired
korg 770
and the maxikorg 800 which is a dual 770 in an upper and lower keyboard so keyboard splits can be created
the korg delta which i have reworked as a paraphonic synth
vp330 which i have been working on the top octave divide down osc and i have recreated the choir resonator and the string resonator
this is a special synth in that the choir has an upper and lower setting so you can have splits but the string is for the whole keyboard and the vocoder section is nice also as you can set which synth part is going to be the carrier and on what section upper or lower
i have recreated the resonators for the korg lamda and it uses the same divide down osc
im just waiting for the xml to be finished so i can sstart doing the gui for them

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 5:10 am
by jhulk
this is a gx-1 voice with out the pitch settings and fine tune and pitchbend and lfo which are on the main pannel
these modules are what is used to program the plug in cartridge modules there are 10 for each tone section and have a switch to bring them in so thats 20 different tones this was before cpu and patch memories these were special carts that had pots as screwdriver adjustable and they were set to what a real pot would be set to
there are 70 preset tone carts in the gx-1
as a polyvoice is made up of 2 tone boards by having 2 tones mixed very interesting sounds could be done this was not seen in a digital synth until the korg dss1 and then the m1 series used the same technique in fact all of korgs synths even the kronos uses the 2 tones mixed technique for its sound creation
this picture shows what a poly voice would be
the gx-1 is special as each tone voice has different intervals of pitches and have 6 buttons to choose them
the pitches are arranged in organ footage intervals which makes it very interesting as there are footage intervals that are not on any type of other synth
there is also a pull out section that allows you to program fine pitch for each
the gx-1 is special in that the cs80 is only one section of the synth the gx-1 has 2 poly 8 voice sections which have dual tone boards
it has a mono section which has 1 tone board
and a foot pedals section which also has 2 tone boards and has sub harmonic pitch intervals and it is mono
the upper and lower manual can have them linked for 4 tones at 8 notes poly so massive sounds can be created
and its all done with osc no samples are used in my creation of it
im doing the gui like the picture of the real thing with the added pitch buttons and fine tune and the bender and lfo

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 1:10 pm
by Bud Weiser

> jhulk wrote:as for classic synth modules
> im working on a few
> the yamaha gx-1 which the cs80 was designed from
> the sk20d which yayajohn is sampling for me from his synth that i repaired
> korg 770
> and the maxikorg 800 which is a dual 770 in an upper and lower keyboard so keyboard splits can be created
> the korg delta which i have reworked as a paraphonic synth
> vp330 which i have been working on the top octave divide down osc and i have recreated the choir resonator and the string resonator
> this is a special synth in that the choir has an upper and lower setting so you can have splits but the string is for the whole keyboard and the vocoder section is nice also as you can set which synth part is going to be the carrier and on what section upper or lower
> i have recreated the resonators for the korg lamda and it uses the same divide down osc
> im just waiting for the xml to be finished so i can sstart doing the gui for them

Wow, man, you must be extremely busy !
I´ve read all your posts in this thread.
It all sounds very promising and I wish you the best for your creations.
Can´t wait to see ´em in action.
good luck
Bud

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 2:08 pm
by dante

> Bud Weiser wrote: Wow, man, you must be extremely busy !
> I´ve read all your posts in this thread.
> It all sounds very promising and I wish you the best for your creations.
> Can´t wait to see ´em in action.
> good luck
> Bud

+1
Sounds like 2015 will be a great year for new Scope synths.

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 2:44 pm
by jhulk
there all im modular form at the moment
im waiting for wills and sharcs xml gui so that i can create the visual panels with 32bit control

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 3:56 am
by Ditykman
Hello all
Sorry but what is Junow? Is existing? a new plug?
Thanks

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:21 am
by jhulk
no its just a picture that dante did for a wish list
a jx8p voice would be easier than the jupiter 8
as the juno osc is available and you just use 2 the jx8p also has an extra envelope than the jx3p but looses the sequencer of the jx3p
i have a modular module of the dual chorus as used in the juno

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 10:04 am
by Ditykman
Ok man
Thanks

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 6:38 am
by vascomusic

> jhulk wrote:there all im modular form at the moment
> im waiting for wills and sharcs xml gui so that i can create the visual panels with 32bit control

Does anyone know what the progression status is of the XML GUI ?

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 8:02 am
by jhulk
goto bcmodular.co.uk all the info is there
and the github source

#### Re: Can we have a recreation of this in M4 ?

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 10:50 pm
by w_ellis
I'm just finishing up the last feature (Parameter Presets) for the next release of ScopeSync at the moment. This will be our first public beta release and should be available in the next week. As jhulk says, feel free to pop over to http://bcmodular.co.uk/forum/index.php if you want a sneak peak, or to get more insight into the progress.